4 ms·

Recommendations like this should always include suggestions on what to replace it with. Cannabis works for the relaxation part very well, but not exactly for th

Recommendations like this should always include suggestions on what to replace it with. Cannabis works for the relaxation part very well, but not exactly for the sociability aspect.

retcon 4y ago
Don't smoke heroin, try Oxycontin! Sorry for the snark but I'm nursing a hangover created in the company of a important friend who's promising to quit drinking after moving state next month, so this is a rather timely paper. However if my friend were to merely substitute another intoxicant I'd lose my mind and probably my wonderful friend. So I personally wouldn't suggest alternative habits at least. Edit: punctuation
- Jimajesty 4y ago
  Replacement could imply more than habitual use of substances. I've found the hardest part of not drinking to be the loss of the sociable activities I engage with while drinking. I've certainly used marijuana as an "intermediary" between drinking and not drinking as it seemed like a way to engage with inebriation without drinking and later would stop using marijuana when I realized I was enjoying my activities more or less the same with or without its use.
- smileysteve 4y ago
  Maybe one day we will have the scientific studies, but your comparison is not a great correlation. Where Oxycontin, heroin, and alcohol are all easy to overdose on, have highly physically addictive properties. Thc does not have the characteristics. Oxy is sold that it reduces physical addiction, when used for short periods and per instructions, but it does not eliminate physical addiction.
sverona 4y ago
Speak for yourself.
retrac 4y ago
I am not sure I can /recommend/ it; sobriety is underrated. But a number of people have proposed GHB or perhaps a prodrug of GHB as an alcohol substitute over the years (for example [1]). It acts on the same receptors in nearly the same way. (It reverses alcohol withdrawal so effectively it is used for this purpose in some countries medically.) Subjectively it feels very much like alcohol. It is probably about as addictive. But it's almost non-toxic by comparison. No liver damage. Doesn't affect nutrient absorption. Milder hangover. It'll probably never be legal for regulatory reasons. (If alcohol were introduced today, it would likely be banned. Even a relatively safer alcohol substitute runs into the problem of still being rather dangerous and so getting through the red tape.) [1] https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/135106/synthetic-alcohol-substitute-could-eliminate-health/ https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/135106/synthetic-alcohol-sub...
- vsef 4y ago
  GHB is a great alcohol substitute in many ways but also has an extremely unforgiving dose response curve with doses that can't be safely eyeballed and that build up in unpredictable ways over successive dosings. The lethal to effective dose ratio is worse than for alcohol, with doses that are much smaller and easier to accidentally ingest. Almost all regular users will have overshot the mark and knocked themselves out at some point, the edge for this level of mild overdose is much lower and sharper than for alcohol. It is safer than alcohol in terms of properly dosed effects, but it has many safety drawbacks in terms of using safely in public social settings the way alcohol is used. It's not just regulatory difficulties with it as an alcohol substitute.
- dzhiurgis 4y ago
  If you are struggling with insomnia after coming off alcohol - try valerian sleeping pills. They work similar to GHB or alcohol.
yakubin 4y ago
Lemonade/tea is great for the social aspect. Relaxation - I just go shooting photos. Activity is better than "relaxation substance" (soma).
pstuart 4y ago
Kratom hits the spot for me. It's not without concerns as it has addictive potential but it takes the edge off emotionally and smooths over my chronic pain. I used to use cannabis but I still do (ahem), but it makes me stupid and so I try to save it as a special treat.
rjh29 4y ago
Depends on why you drink. If you're doing it because you have social anxiety for example, CBT therapy / exposure therapy is the real solution to avoid dependence on alcohol. If you're drinking to cope with negative emotions, again CBT, mindfulness, making yourself busier, social connections, exercise, medicine. For simple 'relaxation' I am significantly more relaxed sober than I ever was when drinking. The day after a binge spiked my anxiety sky high, and even when drinking I was always preoccupied with the next drink.
barbazoo 4y ago
I'm responsible for my own body and what I put in it. It's not some paper's responsibility to tell you how to poison yourself.

Recommendations like this should always include suggestions on what to replace it with. Cannabis works for the relaxation part very well, but not exactly for the sociability aspect.

retcon 4y ago

Don't smoke heroin, try Oxycontin! Sorry for the snark but I'm nursing a hangover created in the company of a important friend who's promising to quit drinking after moving state next month, so this is a rather timely paper. However if my friend were to merely substitute another intoxicant I'd lose my mind and probably my wonderful friend. So I personally wouldn't suggest alternative habits at least. Edit: punctuation

Jimajesty 4y ago
Replacement could imply more than habitual use of substances. I've found the hardest part of not drinking to be the loss of the sociable activities I engage with while drinking. I've certainly used marijuana as an "intermediary" between drinking and not drinking as it seemed like a way to engage with inebriation without drinking and later would stop using marijuana when I realized I was enjoying my activities more or less the same with or without its use.
smileysteve 4y ago
Maybe one day we will have the scientific studies, but your comparison is not a great correlation. Where Oxycontin, heroin, and alcohol are all easy to overdose on, have highly physically addictive properties. Thc does not have the characteristics. Oxy is sold that it reduces physical addiction, when used for short periods and per instructions, but it does not eliminate physical addiction.

sverona 4y ago

Speak for yourself.

retrac 4y ago

I am not sure I can /recommend/ it; sobriety is underrated. But a number of people have proposed GHB or perhaps a prodrug of GHB as an alcohol substitute over the years (for example [1]). It acts on the same receptors in nearly the same way. (It reverses alcohol withdrawal so effectively it is used for this purpose in some countries medically.) Subjectively it feels very much like alcohol. It is probably about as addictive. But it's almost non-toxic by comparison. No liver damage. Doesn't affect nutrient absorption. Milder hangover. It'll probably never be legal for regulatory reasons. (If alcohol were introduced today, it would likely be banned. Even a relatively safer alcohol substitute runs into the problem of still being rather dangerous and so getting through the red tape.) [1] https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/135106/synthetic-alcohol-substitute-could-eliminate-health/ https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/135106/synthetic-alcohol-sub...

vsef 4y ago
GHB is a great alcohol substitute in many ways but also has an extremely unforgiving dose response curve with doses that can't be safely eyeballed and that build up in unpredictable ways over successive dosings. The lethal to effective dose ratio is worse than for alcohol, with doses that are much smaller and easier to accidentally ingest. Almost all regular users will have overshot the mark and knocked themselves out at some point, the edge for this level of mild overdose is much lower and sharper than for alcohol. It is safer than alcohol in terms of properly dosed effects, but it has many safety drawbacks in terms of using safely in public social settings the way alcohol is used. It's not just regulatory difficulties with it as an alcohol substitute.
dzhiurgis 4y ago
If you are struggling with insomnia after coming off alcohol - try valerian sleeping pills. They work similar to GHB or alcohol.

yakubin 4y ago

Lemonade/tea is great for the social aspect. Relaxation - I just go shooting photos. Activity is better than "relaxation substance" (soma).

pstuart 4y ago

Kratom hits the spot for me. It's not without concerns as it has addictive potential but it takes the edge off emotionally and smooths over my chronic pain. I used to use cannabis but I still do (ahem), but it makes me stupid and so I try to save it as a special treat.

rjh29 4y ago

Depends on why you drink. If you're doing it because you have social anxiety for example, CBT therapy / exposure therapy is the real solution to avoid dependence on alcohol. If you're drinking to cope with negative emotions, again CBT, mindfulness, making yourself busier, social connections, exercise, medicine. For simple 'relaxation' I am significantly more relaxed sober than I ever was when drinking. The day after a binge spiked my anxiety sky high, and even when drinking I was always preoccupied with the next drink.

barbazoo 4y ago

I'm responsible for my own body and what I put in it. It's not some paper's responsibility to tell you how to poison yourself.