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Shopping on amazon is really an awful experience nowdays. I really do not want to search through 40 pages of water kettles of really dubious brands. It is so an

Shopping on amazon is really an awful experience nowdays. I really do not want to search through 40 pages of water kettles of really dubious brands. It is so anxiety inducing and unpleasant.

m463 4y ago
I think amazon has jumped the shark[1] There is no practical way to buy a reputable/brand name on amazon. Some brand names are "available", but it seems not officially and people are buying them at a store and shipping them to customers. Other brand names are available, but the search results are paid (and manipulated) so they get crowded off the page by sponsored and "5 star (2)" results. and so amazon as a brand is associated with junk. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark
- themacguffinman 4y ago
  You sometimes can't even get the right thing from official brand stores. I bought a thermal paste product from the official Amazon ThermalGrizzly store (I did check) but Amazon delivered me a fake. Amazon co-mingles inventory. The only reason I could quickly tell it was fake is because ThermalGrizzly provides an online serial number verification system, which isn't very common among most products. I'm not sure I'd trust Amazon for anything.
  - kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
    You have to evaluate if a product is worth counterfeiting. For many goods the clone factories aren't going to bother. Amazon is also a convenient onshore gateway to Aliexpress resellers with less shipping ambiguity.
    - bryanrasmussen 4y ago
      >You have to evaluate if a product is worth counterfeiting. this does not seem to be worthwhile for someone wanting to purchase something, my estimates as to if something is worth counterfeiting requires me to have a rather deep understanding of the brand's importance in the world that I would not have for any but the most notable brands, aside from that I have to know something about how easy/costly it is to counterfeit and get things on Amazon to make a model in my mind if the brand was important enough for someone to fake it. So, for example, if it becomes significantly cheaper to counterfeit things the importance of brands counterfeited (in consumer reach etc.) should drop. That's a lot of variables. Think I'll just go to the store.
  - dr_spicy 4y ago
    Amazon has a similar service now, but brands need to onboard so it's not super wide spread yet https://brandservices.amazon.com/transparency https://brandservices.amazon.com/transparency
- ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
  A couple of weeks ago, I wanted to order a couple of pairs of Levis jeans. There was no way I'd do that on Amazon. I got them from Costco, instead.
  - imissfirefox 4y ago
    Same situation. Got them from the Levi’s store. In my mind Amazon=counterfeits/stolen I’d only order very specific things from Amazon and as a result haven’t actually ordered in a couple years.
    - ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
      With all the hand-wringing about how Amazon has completely monopolized online ordering, I'd think that having a true "honest broker" storefront would be a fairly natural way to compete. Amazon has become a truly awful storefront, and this has accelerated markedly, in just the last couple of years.
      - tomohawk 4y ago
        You would think, but since Amazon is a monopoly and not an honest broker, there's no way to compete with them. If the people who were supposed to be keeping them in line actually went after them aggressively, then it might be possible to start a competitor.
  - ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
    And here's another post, I made here, about two months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31625376 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31625376 The fake is still up for sale.
- ant6n 4y ago
  The problem I’m having in Germany ist that only Amazon reliable delivers to my door, usually next day. Every other store ships with DHL, which after several days pretends that they ring you, when they don’t, and then u can go pick it up at the DHL store a day later. That’s their moat.
  - sveme 4y ago
    Weird. Out of the four major delivery services, DHL is by far the best and most accommodating.
  - sofixa 4y ago
    I think most of the complaints are directed at the amazon.com. They do not at all reflect my experience with amazon.fr - yes there's no name crap but there's also lots of legit stuff, and it's the majority that comes up in search results (confirmed through third parties recommending the same legit stuff with amazon links).
  - mk89 4y ago
    Weird, DHL is for me the best and most professional of all. The experience you mentioned happens to me with DPD and very often with GLS. Hermes is also pretty good and professional. Maybe it depends on the location...
    - ant6n 4y ago
      Maybe it does depend on the location, maybe you're lucky. But the complains process with DHL is impossible, so if you have bad delivery ppl in your area (in my case downtown Berlin), there's nothing you can do.
  - spockz 4y ago
    In the Netherlands they seem to ship exclusively with DHL. And all products arrive in the evening slot. Which means that next day delivery is usually around 21:00-22:00 which is typically too late to be useful. PostNL is the most reisje local carrier here. Ups is the best but almost never used, so far only by Apple. Dpd, GLs, etc, are all rubbish.
- vannevar 4y ago
  Yes, because Amazon has created perverse incentives for anonymous manufacturers to fabricate as many "brands" as possible, there are now so many of them that they crowd out actual brands. The original purpose of a brand name was to give a reputable seller a recognizable way to differentiate a quality product or service from anonymous competitors. But search and recommendation on Amazon favors the anonymous sellers. Amazon today is less about selling things to consumers and more about selling consumers to anonymous Chinese suppliers.
- throwaway0a5e 4y ago
  If you just want to buy chinese consumer junk of middling quality or you are buying industrial widgets based on part number or specification those things mostly aren't an issue.
ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
Here's a post I made, here, about two years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25582762 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25582762 I don't think it's improved with age, but the links aren't any good, anymore.
SoftTalker 4y ago
Yeah I haven't bought anything on Amazon for a couple of years now. Got burned once too many times. I went back to buying mostly in local stores. If they don't have what I want, I go online to manufacturers' websites if possible, or to reputable sellers.
duxup 4y ago
I play a lot of card games with my kids. I wanted a new card shuffler. All I got was pages of the same 3 models of shuffler from every nonsense name brand you could think of. But really just 3 choices…
- AlexandrB 4y ago
  It's like how every wall clock you buy - from Aliexpress to Crate & Barrel - will have the same cheap mechanism running the arms: https://www.amazon.com/Include-Movement-Mechanism-Operated-Replacement/dp/B074GQXPW1/ https://www.amazon.com/Include-Movement-Mechanism-Operated-R...
  - jiggawatts 4y ago
    I think part of the problem is that on that page there is no obvious way to see any information about the seller. I just see a single brand name “TIKROUND”, which looks like one of those fake Chinese names mentioned in the article. How can I get more information about the seller!? I scrolled through the listing twice and couldn’t see any way to get more information!
bee_rider 4y ago
It is fine for, like, getting an HDMI cable. I would never buy something from Amazon that touched my food. Electronics more complicated than a cable require some review, figuring out if there's a reputable brand underneath, etc.
- Nexxxeh 4y ago
  >It is fine for, like, getting an HDMI cable. Only true for what are, now, low-end HDMI cables. Really difficult to get a good one that's actually within spec for high-bandwidth applications.
  - shantara 4y ago
    I highly recommend Blue Jeans Cable - https://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/hdmi-cables/hdmi-cable.htm https://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/hdmi-cables/hdmi-cable.... Their cables were the only ones that consistently delivered full promised bandwidth and stable connection even at long cable lengths. Plus, their email support has been very helpful, and had the same “quality cables, no bullshit” attitude as the rest of the website. No affiliation, just a happy customer of 5+ years.
    - fmajid 4y ago
      +1, BJC is the place to go for custom AV cables not tainted by audiophile snake oil.
    - KerrAvon 4y ago
      Blue Jeans seems to have pretty reasonable prices, too, although I didn't look at shipping. I've found Monoprice's higher-end HDMI cables to be reliable.
WildGreenLeave 4y ago
In The Netherlands we have 2 big mainstream shops for electronics, this is Bol.com and Coolblue.nl. Bol.com started out as a webshop and moved into a marketplace idea (like Amazon does). I know a lot of people that prefer Coolblue over Bol because of this exact reason. Every product that Coolblue is selling has at least some kind of guarantee of quality, because if it is bad, they will have to replace it. Sadly enough, at this point Amazon.nl is overshadowing this by giving insane discounts and refunds to customers, so I hope they do not win over Bol.com, but I am anxious about it.
- contravariant 4y ago
  Bol.com has put themselves in a bit of an awkward position by being at the mercy of third party resellers, but all Amazon just seems to sell the stuff you can get in the German Amazon with slightly shorter delivery times (for some things). And at least with Bol.com you only need to deal with (sometimes dodgy) companies in the Netherlands, whereas with amazon you haven't got a clue where it's coming from, and a lot of it just seems to be stuff from alibaba at a big markup.
libraryatnight 4y ago
I feel this in my soul. I wanted a new french press. I tried three from Amazon, two of the same model arrived broken, the third arrived appearing intact but broke on first use. I ended up just refunding and buying one from le creuset from their website. It arrived safe and is still alive and kicking. I wanted some weight sensors for an arduino project, Arrow had them but Amazon also listed them but in bags of 4 for about the price 2 would have cost from Arrow, plus they'd arrive faster. They ended up being varying weight sensors ripped directly out of various electronic scales and 3/4 didn't work. Had to order from Arrow anyway. My wife wanted one of those percussive massage guns for post workout, Amazon had the best price but then I saw in some of the reviews people showing that the items they received from Amazon weren't legit and the company (hypervolt iirc) wouldn't honor any warranty from one purchased from Amazon. I was pretty much done at that point. We ended up picking a different model but when we did we went straight through the manufacturer. Shopping on Amazon sucks.

Shopping on amazon is really an awful experience nowdays. I really do not want to search through 40 pages of water kettles of really dubious brands. It is so anxiety inducing and unpleasant.

m463 4y ago

I think amazon has jumped the shark[1] There is no practical way to buy a reputable/brand name on amazon. Some brand names are "available", but it seems not officially and people are buying them at a store and shipping them to customers. Other brand names are available, but the search results are paid (and manipulated) so they get crowded off the page by sponsored and "5 star (2)" results. and so amazon as a brand is associated with junk. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark

themacguffinman 4y ago
You sometimes can't even get the right thing from official brand stores. I bought a thermal paste product from the official Amazon ThermalGrizzly store (I did check) but Amazon delivered me a fake. Amazon co-mingles inventory. The only reason I could quickly tell it was fake is because ThermalGrizzly provides an online serial number verification system, which isn't very common among most products. I'm not sure I'd trust Amazon for anything.
- kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
  You have to evaluate if a product is worth counterfeiting. For many goods the clone factories aren't going to bother. Amazon is also a convenient onshore gateway to Aliexpress resellers with less shipping ambiguity.
  - bryanrasmussen 4y ago
    >You have to evaluate if a product is worth counterfeiting. this does not seem to be worthwhile for someone wanting to purchase something, my estimates as to if something is worth counterfeiting requires me to have a rather deep understanding of the brand's importance in the world that I would not have for any but the most notable brands, aside from that I have to know something about how easy/costly it is to counterfeit and get things on Amazon to make a model in my mind if the brand was important enough for someone to fake it. So, for example, if it becomes significantly cheaper to counterfeit things the importance of brands counterfeited (in consumer reach etc.) should drop. That's a lot of variables. Think I'll just go to the store.
- dr_spicy 4y ago
  Amazon has a similar service now, but brands need to onboard so it's not super wide spread yet https://brandservices.amazon.com/transparency https://brandservices.amazon.com/transparency
ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
A couple of weeks ago, I wanted to order a couple of pairs of Levis jeans. There was no way I'd do that on Amazon. I got them from Costco, instead.
- imissfirefox 4y ago
  Same situation. Got them from the Levi’s store. In my mind Amazon=counterfeits/stolen I’d only order very specific things from Amazon and as a result haven’t actually ordered in a couple years.
  - ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
    With all the hand-wringing about how Amazon has completely monopolized online ordering, I'd think that having a true "honest broker" storefront would be a fairly natural way to compete. Amazon has become a truly awful storefront, and this has accelerated markedly, in just the last couple of years.
    - tomohawk 4y ago
      You would think, but since Amazon is a monopoly and not an honest broker, there's no way to compete with them. If the people who were supposed to be keeping them in line actually went after them aggressively, then it might be possible to start a competitor.
- ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago
  And here's another post, I made here, about two months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31625376 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31625376 The fake is still up for sale.
ant6n 4y ago
The problem I’m having in Germany ist that only Amazon reliable delivers to my door, usually next day. Every other store ships with DHL, which after several days pretends that they ring you, when they don’t, and then u can go pick it up at the DHL store a day later. That’s their moat.
- sveme 4y ago
  Weird. Out of the four major delivery services, DHL is by far the best and most accommodating.
- sofixa 4y ago
  I think most of the complaints are directed at the amazon.com. They do not at all reflect my experience with amazon.fr - yes there's no name crap but there's also lots of legit stuff, and it's the majority that comes up in search results (confirmed through third parties recommending the same legit stuff with amazon links).
- mk89 4y ago
  Weird, DHL is for me the best and most professional of all. The experience you mentioned happens to me with DPD and very often with GLS. Hermes is also pretty good and professional. Maybe it depends on the location...
  - ant6n 4y ago
    Maybe it does depend on the location, maybe you're lucky. But the complains process with DHL is impossible, so if you have bad delivery ppl in your area (in my case downtown Berlin), there's nothing you can do.
- spockz 4y ago
  In the Netherlands they seem to ship exclusively with DHL. And all products arrive in the evening slot. Which means that next day delivery is usually around 21:00-22:00 which is typically too late to be useful. PostNL is the most reisje local carrier here. Ups is the best but almost never used, so far only by Apple. Dpd, GLs, etc, are all rubbish.
vannevar 4y ago
Yes, because Amazon has created perverse incentives for anonymous manufacturers to fabricate as many "brands" as possible, there are now so many of them that they crowd out actual brands. The original purpose of a brand name was to give a reputable seller a recognizable way to differentiate a quality product or service from anonymous competitors. But search and recommendation on Amazon favors the anonymous sellers. Amazon today is less about selling things to consumers and more about selling consumers to anonymous Chinese suppliers.
throwaway0a5e 4y ago
If you just want to buy chinese consumer junk of middling quality or you are buying industrial widgets based on part number or specification those things mostly aren't an issue.

ChrisMarshallNY 4y ago

Here's a post I made, here, about two years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25582762 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25582762 I don't think it's improved with age, but the links aren't any good, anymore.

SoftTalker 4y ago

Yeah I haven't bought anything on Amazon for a couple of years now. Got burned once too many times. I went back to buying mostly in local stores. If they don't have what I want, I go online to manufacturers' websites if possible, or to reputable sellers.

duxup 4y ago

I play a lot of card games with my kids. I wanted a new card shuffler. All I got was pages of the same 3 models of shuffler from every nonsense name brand you could think of. But really just 3 choices…

AlexandrB 4y ago
It's like how every wall clock you buy - from Aliexpress to Crate & Barrel - will have the same cheap mechanism running the arms: https://www.amazon.com/Include-Movement-Mechanism-Operated-Replacement/dp/B074GQXPW1/ https://www.amazon.com/Include-Movement-Mechanism-Operated-R...
- jiggawatts 4y ago
  I think part of the problem is that on that page there is no obvious way to see any information about the seller. I just see a single brand name “TIKROUND”, which looks like one of those fake Chinese names mentioned in the article. How can I get more information about the seller!? I scrolled through the listing twice and couldn’t see any way to get more information!

bee_rider 4y ago

It is fine for, like, getting an HDMI cable. I would never buy something from Amazon that touched my food. Electronics more complicated than a cable require some review, figuring out if there's a reputable brand underneath, etc.

Nexxxeh 4y ago
>It is fine for, like, getting an HDMI cable. Only true for what are, now, low-end HDMI cables. Really difficult to get a good one that's actually within spec for high-bandwidth applications.
- shantara 4y ago
  I highly recommend Blue Jeans Cable - https://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/hdmi-cables/hdmi-cable.htm https://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/hdmi-cables/hdmi-cable.... Their cables were the only ones that consistently delivered full promised bandwidth and stable connection even at long cable lengths. Plus, their email support has been very helpful, and had the same “quality cables, no bullshit” attitude as the rest of the website. No affiliation, just a happy customer of 5+ years.
  - fmajid 4y ago
    +1, BJC is the place to go for custom AV cables not tainted by audiophile snake oil.
  - KerrAvon 4y ago
    Blue Jeans seems to have pretty reasonable prices, too, although I didn't look at shipping. I've found Monoprice's higher-end HDMI cables to be reliable.

WildGreenLeave 4y ago

In The Netherlands we have 2 big mainstream shops for electronics, this is Bol.com and Coolblue.nl. Bol.com started out as a webshop and moved into a marketplace idea (like Amazon does). I know a lot of people that prefer Coolblue over Bol because of this exact reason. Every product that Coolblue is selling has at least some kind of guarantee of quality, because if it is bad, they will have to replace it. Sadly enough, at this point Amazon.nl is overshadowing this by giving insane discounts and refunds to customers, so I hope they do not win over Bol.com, but I am anxious about it.

contravariant 4y ago
Bol.com has put themselves in a bit of an awkward position by being at the mercy of third party resellers, but all Amazon just seems to sell the stuff you can get in the German Amazon with slightly shorter delivery times (for some things). And at least with Bol.com you only need to deal with (sometimes dodgy) companies in the Netherlands, whereas with amazon you haven't got a clue where it's coming from, and a lot of it just seems to be stuff from alibaba at a big markup.

libraryatnight 4y ago

I feel this in my soul. I wanted a new french press. I tried three from Amazon, two of the same model arrived broken, the third arrived appearing intact but broke on first use. I ended up just refunding and buying one from le creuset from their website. It arrived safe and is still alive and kicking. I wanted some weight sensors for an arduino project, Arrow had them but Amazon also listed them but in bags of 4 for about the price 2 would have cost from Arrow, plus they'd arrive faster. They ended up being varying weight sensors ripped directly out of various electronic scales and 3/4 didn't work. Had to order from Arrow anyway. My wife wanted one of those percussive massage guns for post workout, Amazon had the best price but then I saw in some of the reviews people showing that the items they received from Amazon weren't legit and the company (hypervolt iirc) wouldn't honor any warranty from one purchased from Amazon. I was pretty much done at that point. We ended up picking a different model but when we did we went straight through the manufacturer. Shopping on Amazon sucks.