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I think the root issue for PeerTube is that video monetization has not been figured out. Established YouTubers won't switch away from existing revenue streams u

I think the root issue for PeerTube is that video monetization has not been figured out. Established YouTubers won't switch away from existing revenue streams unless there's parity. New YouTubers will focus on building a business and will go where the money is. Rock and a hard place. That's where I would focus on platform improvements though.

raybb 4y ago
I see how this is true for programmatic ads. But do you think the same goes for sponsored videos? If sponsored videos are paid for X number of views why wouldn't that work for peertube?
- hombre_fatal 4y ago
  I don't know how Youtube ads work, but I would think it's like Adsense where you can make money long before you are big enough to attract sponsors. Platform-level ads are surely for everyone not big enough to attract sponsors.
- snoopy_telex 4y ago
  Getting a realistic number of views out of a p2p service is... difficult. It's too easy to fudge. Youtube acts like a neutral party that won't cheat, because it has no reason to. There's no neutral party in peer tube to provide the count.
  - dane-pgp 4y ago
    > Youtube acts like a neutral party that won't cheat, because it has no reason to. Actually it has a huge reason to, and sometimes large advertising companies do get accused of such cheating. [0] You're right, though, that getting accurate numbers is hard even for companies with large budgets to invest in stopping "fake" clicks, which usually involves all sorts of fingerprinting and surveillance tech. Trying to recreate all that in a transparent and privacy-preserving way, across a network of nodes in different jurisdictions, and with no contractual obligations, is... well, if not impossible, then let's just say it's going to need a lot more blockchain to make it work. ;) [0] https://www.marketing-interactive.com/facebook-sued-for-allegedly-inflating-potential-reach https://www.marketing-interactive.com/facebook-sued-for-alle...
YurgenJurgensen 4y ago
This is a manifestation of how we’ve sleepwalked a situation where Google probably should have fallen foul of antitrust legislation but haven’t. They have a pretty tight control over video hosting, video monetisation and video discovery, making it impossible for an incumbent to enter into one of those markets without challenging Google in all three.
- akersten 4y ago
  > They have a pretty tight control over video hosting, video monetisation and video discovery, making it impossible for an incumbent to enter into one of those markets You're kind of putting the cart before the horse here in asserting that those are three independent markets. I could just as easily say that restaurants participate in the "food cooking, table bussing, and patron seating" markets, and that it's way too hard for my upstart kitchen to compete in the food cooking market due to Cheesecake Factory having such tight control over the seating and serving markets. But the reality is, maybe my cuisine just sucks, and the singular market won't entertain it.
  - YurgenJurgensen 4y ago
    Independent content aggregator sites that don't host the content they promote exist. You're on one right now. Independent video hosting that doesn't do frontend also exists, that's just any file hosting service. And independent video monetisation also exists. Many Patreon users don't host their content on Patreon. So yes, they are independent markets.
    - Goronmon 4y ago
      Independent content aggregator sites that don't host the content they promote exist. You're on one right now. Independent video hosting that doesn't do frontend also exists, that's just any file hosting service. And independent video monetisation also exists. Many Patreon users don't host their content on Patreon. So yes, they are independent markets. Isn't this comment explaining why Google isn't facing anti-trust issues?
upupandup 4y ago
You laid out a really good point here, advertisers with big wallets are not going to bet their brand on a decentralized video platform without any centralized moderation. And without those large advertisers your CPM will be extremely low which will just invite even more content aimed at capturing that market (spam, low quality videos). People forget that decentralization doesn't work well for some industries, especially ones that rely on ad revenues (centralized entities) that rely on centralized control over audiences and content allowed on the platform. There's a reason Youtube works so well and its because of its censorship and AI led moderation to appease the big advertisers. You can't rely on some regular joe advertising his Token on PeerTube to continue paying in crypto and neither can creators rely on PeerTube to be able to convert tokens on a third party exchange that is facing insolvency. It's amazing to me how quickly people forget the on-ramp and off-ramp of money is still fiat, nobody is going to hold on to PeerTube's tokens for decades.

raybb 4y ago

I see how this is true for programmatic ads. But do you think the same goes for sponsored videos? If sponsored videos are paid for X number of views why wouldn't that work for peertube?

hombre_fatal 4y ago
I don't know how Youtube ads work, but I would think it's like Adsense where you can make money long before you are big enough to attract sponsors. Platform-level ads are surely for everyone not big enough to attract sponsors.
snoopy_telex 4y ago
Getting a realistic number of views out of a p2p service is... difficult. It's too easy to fudge. Youtube acts like a neutral party that won't cheat, because it has no reason to. There's no neutral party in peer tube to provide the count.
- dane-pgp 4y ago
  > Youtube acts like a neutral party that won't cheat, because it has no reason to. Actually it has a huge reason to, and sometimes large advertising companies do get accused of such cheating. [0] You're right, though, that getting accurate numbers is hard even for companies with large budgets to invest in stopping "fake" clicks, which usually involves all sorts of fingerprinting and surveillance tech. Trying to recreate all that in a transparent and privacy-preserving way, across a network of nodes in different jurisdictions, and with no contractual obligations, is... well, if not impossible, then let's just say it's going to need a lot more blockchain to make it work. ;) [0] https://www.marketing-interactive.com/facebook-sued-for-allegedly-inflating-potential-reach https://www.marketing-interactive.com/facebook-sued-for-alle...

YurgenJurgensen 4y ago

This is a manifestation of how we’ve sleepwalked a situation where Google probably should have fallen foul of antitrust legislation but haven’t. They have a pretty tight control over video hosting, video monetisation and video discovery, making it impossible for an incumbent to enter into one of those markets without challenging Google in all three.

akersten 4y ago
> They have a pretty tight control over video hosting, video monetisation and video discovery, making it impossible for an incumbent to enter into one of those markets You're kind of putting the cart before the horse here in asserting that those are three independent markets. I could just as easily say that restaurants participate in the "food cooking, table bussing, and patron seating" markets, and that it's way too hard for my upstart kitchen to compete in the food cooking market due to Cheesecake Factory having such tight control over the seating and serving markets. But the reality is, maybe my cuisine just sucks, and the singular market won't entertain it.
- YurgenJurgensen 4y ago
  Independent content aggregator sites that don't host the content they promote exist. You're on one right now. Independent video hosting that doesn't do frontend also exists, that's just any file hosting service. And independent video monetisation also exists. Many Patreon users don't host their content on Patreon. So yes, they are independent markets.
  - Goronmon 4y ago
    Independent content aggregator sites that don't host the content they promote exist. You're on one right now. Independent video hosting that doesn't do frontend also exists, that's just any file hosting service. And independent video monetisation also exists. Many Patreon users don't host their content on Patreon. So yes, they are independent markets. Isn't this comment explaining why Google isn't facing anti-trust issues?

upupandup 4y ago

You laid out a really good point here, advertisers with big wallets are not going to bet their brand on a decentralized video platform without any centralized moderation. And without those large advertisers your CPM will be extremely low which will just invite even more content aimed at capturing that market (spam, low quality videos). People forget that decentralization doesn't work well for some industries, especially ones that rely on ad revenues (centralized entities) that rely on centralized control over audiences and content allowed on the platform. There's a reason Youtube works so well and its because of its censorship and AI led moderation to appease the big advertisers. You can't rely on some regular joe advertising his Token on PeerTube to continue paying in crypto and neither can creators rely on PeerTube to be able to convert tokens on a third party exchange that is facing insolvency. It's amazing to me how quickly people forget the on-ramp and off-ramp of money is still fiat, nobody is going to hold on to PeerTube's tokens for decades.