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The big problem, at least in the US, is that we don't build things anymore. The homeless camp 2 blocks from me is one glaring proof. The lack of power generati

The big problem, at least in the US, is that we don't build things anymore. The homeless camp 2 blocks from me is one glaring proof. The lack of power generation, power transmission, and pretty much any infrastructure you can think of is another. I agree that there is some conflict of interest between humans and untouched nature, and I am firmly on the side of us, humanity! What side are you on?

deleted 4y ago
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carapace 4y ago
We do build things. I'm in SF where we have recently replaced the Bay Bridge, dug a big ol' tunnel, put up skyscrapers and luxury condos, etc. What we don't do is build housing. (A lot of people blame NIMBYism for that but the situation is complex.) > The lack of power generation, power transmission, and pretty much any infrastructure you can think of is another. A friend of mine drives a Tesla, he says charging stations are cropping up all over. 5G is rolling out. There is a lot of aging infrastructure that needs to be repaired, rebuilt, or retired, but we're not quite Mad Max yet. > I agree that there is some conflict of interest between humans and untouched nature, and I am firmly on the side of us, humanity! I don't agree with that framing. First of all, tactically, you're siding with the underdog! :) Nature could literally wipe us out in the blink of an eye. A single hurricane can devastate a whole city in a few hours, Godzilla-style. However, that's not the real reason why I don't think there's a real conflict of interest. The reason is that untouched nature is the only baseline (in the entire known universe) for sanity. We need nature. As we enter a computer-mediated "metaverse" or cyberspace, and especially as we allow our infants and children to grow up in it, untouched nature will become exponentially more important as (literal!) grounding for humanity. That's why something like E. O. Wilson's Half Earth proposal is so important ( https://www.half-earthproject.org/ https://www.half-earthproject.org/ ) We only have one biosphere in the entire universe, of course we should try to preserve it intact and in working order! After all we have the rest of the solar system to do human stuff, eh?
- BurningFrog 4y ago
  You're probably giving a more thoughtful answer than my rant deserved :) What I was trying to express was said better by Marc Andreessen "It’s Time to Build" manifesto. Read that instead: https://a16z.com/2020/04/18/its-time-to-build/ https://a16z.com/2020/04/18/its-time-to-build/ The Bay Bridge only got built because the old one proved seismically unsafe, and that took 24 years, with a 2500% cost overrun, according to Wikipedia. No other bridges will be build in the SF bay, despite huge needs.
  - carapace 4y ago
    I always appreciate a good opportunity to stand on the the soapbox. :) I read Andreessen's piece (and caught the reference) I just think he's wrong.

deleted 4y ago

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carapace 4y ago

We do build things. I'm in SF where we have recently replaced the Bay Bridge, dug a big ol' tunnel, put up skyscrapers and luxury condos, etc. What we don't do is build housing. (A lot of people blame NIMBYism for that but the situation is complex.) > The lack of power generation, power transmission, and pretty much any infrastructure you can think of is another. A friend of mine drives a Tesla, he says charging stations are cropping up all over. 5G is rolling out. There is a lot of aging infrastructure that needs to be repaired, rebuilt, or retired, but we're not quite Mad Max yet. > I agree that there is some conflict of interest between humans and untouched nature, and I am firmly on the side of us, humanity! I don't agree with that framing. First of all, tactically, you're siding with the underdog! :) Nature could literally wipe us out in the blink of an eye. A single hurricane can devastate a whole city in a few hours, Godzilla-style. However, that's not the real reason why I don't think there's a real conflict of interest. The reason is that untouched nature is the only baseline (in the entire known universe) for sanity. We need nature. As we enter a computer-mediated "metaverse" or cyberspace, and especially as we allow our infants and children to grow up in it, untouched nature will become exponentially more important as (literal!) grounding for humanity. That's why something like E. O. Wilson's Half Earth proposal is so important ( https://www.half-earthproject.org/ https://www.half-earthproject.org/ ) We only have one biosphere in the entire universe, of course we should try to preserve it intact and in working order! After all we have the rest of the solar system to do human stuff, eh?

BurningFrog 4y ago
You're probably giving a more thoughtful answer than my rant deserved :) What I was trying to express was said better by Marc Andreessen "It’s Time to Build" manifesto. Read that instead: https://a16z.com/2020/04/18/its-time-to-build/ https://a16z.com/2020/04/18/its-time-to-build/ The Bay Bridge only got built because the old one proved seismically unsafe, and that took 24 years, with a 2500% cost overrun, according to Wikipedia. No other bridges will be build in the SF bay, despite huge needs.
- carapace 4y ago
  I always appreciate a good opportunity to stand on the the soapbox. :) I read Andreessen's piece (and caught the reference) I just think he's wrong.