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“The ultimate hidden truth of the world is that it is something we make, and could just as easily make differently.” -David Graeber I know this reads as a gro

“The ultimate hidden truth of the world is that it is something we make, and could just as easily make differently.” -David Graeber I know this reads as a gross oversimplification but it rings true all the time. Imagine if almost everyone collectively at Salesforce said, “nope, this is dumb! We are going to stop working until this benefit is handed out to everyone at the company.” It’d be changed back / expanded within 48 hours.

brigandish 4y ago
You'd have to solve the prisoner's dilemma though, and that's something Graeber certainly hasn't managed to crack.
- HWR_14 4y ago
  Why would you need to solve it? Because the prisoners dilemma suggests everyone should hold out for the holiday.
  - brigandish 4y ago
    The reason the dilemma is of any interest is because people do defect.
- AmericanChopper 4y ago
  You don’t have to solve it. There’s not really any problem to solve to begin with. People who are happy with the changed working conditions will continue to work there. People who do not want to tolerate the change will not continue to work there. Every person can precisely choose the outcome they want, without cooperation from anybody.
  - brigandish 4y ago
    That's not what I was responding to though. This is: > Imagine if almost everyone collectively at Salesforce said, “nope, this is dumb! We are going to stop working until this benefit is handed out to everyone at the company.” It’d be changed back / expanded within 48 hours. That's a prisoner's dilemma, people holding out for the best they can get. If enough people defect then it won't work.
    - AmericanChopper 4y ago
      The prisoners dilemma doesn’t apply to this situation, because every single individual involved can, without any cooperation from anybody else, easily get the optimal outcome for themselves.
      - Shish2k 4y ago
        If you define “optimal outcome” as “people who don’t like having their benefits revoked quit”, yes. But I think a lot of people would define “optimal outcome” as “people who don’t like having their benefits revoked don’t get them revoked”.
        AmericanChopper 4y ago
        The distinction is unimportant, and if you care about it very much then you’re just losing on purpose.
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]

brigandish 4y ago

You'd have to solve the prisoner's dilemma though, and that's something Graeber certainly hasn't managed to crack.

HWR_14 4y ago
Why would you need to solve it? Because the prisoners dilemma suggests everyone should hold out for the holiday.
- brigandish 4y ago
  The reason the dilemma is of any interest is because people do defect.
AmericanChopper 4y ago
You don’t have to solve it. There’s not really any problem to solve to begin with. People who are happy with the changed working conditions will continue to work there. People who do not want to tolerate the change will not continue to work there. Every person can precisely choose the outcome they want, without cooperation from anybody.
- brigandish 4y ago
  That's not what I was responding to though. This is: > Imagine if almost everyone collectively at Salesforce said, “nope, this is dumb! We are going to stop working until this benefit is handed out to everyone at the company.” It’d be changed back / expanded within 48 hours. That's a prisoner's dilemma, people holding out for the best they can get. If enough people defect then it won't work.
  - AmericanChopper 4y ago
    The prisoners dilemma doesn’t apply to this situation, because every single individual involved can, without any cooperation from anybody else, easily get the optimal outcome for themselves.
    - Shish2k 4y ago
      If you define “optimal outcome” as “people who don’t like having their benefits revoked quit”, yes. But I think a lot of people would define “optimal outcome” as “people who don’t like having their benefits revoked don’t get them revoked”.
      - AmericanChopper 4y ago
        The distinction is unimportant, and if you care about it very much then you’re just losing on purpose.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]