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Why would it be an insult to your audience? Edit: To respond to both of you and not be repetitive, I would like to refer both of you to the comment that I hav

Why would it be an insult to your audience? Edit: To respond to both of you and not be repetitive, I would like to refer both of you to the comment that I have made here: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3217649 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3217649

nathanb 15y ago
I can't answer for jsavimbi, but I think it insults the audience because it takes the easy way out. It would be like not proofreading your slides and showing up with typos or txt abbrs rather than well-thought out phrases. Swearing works in private conversation for the same reason that other slang and spoken shortcuts work, and it works in casual written conversation for the same reason that abbreviations, shorthand, and inattention to capitalization, spelling, and punctuation work: there's no real expectation of quality. Sure it's lazy and shows a lack of caring, but if a friend is shooting me an email to ask if I'm up for Thai tonight, I don't expect her to proofread and capitalize before sending. That's an appropriate amount of effort for the situation. If you're putting that much effort into a presentation to someone you hope will give you money, however, that's just plain rude. (Some folks, and I suspect this is true for HN commenters at a much higher proportion than it is true for the general population, prefer to spend the time on all communication, regardless of formality or venue, to make it decent. I believe this is a good habit to cultivate, but I don't insist upon it in others).
jsavimbi 15y ago
It's an insult to pepper your audience with profanity when they took the time out of their day to pay attention to what you had to share. It shows that you did not take the time to properly prepare and present your arguments. It shows that you are immature. It shows that you have a complete and total disregard for even the most basic of social forums. And it shows that Mr. Holman is so self-absorbed that when confronted with what in polite society is considered ill-mannered and poorly timed swearing in a presentation, he doubled down and bereft of supervision decided to lecture the audience even further as to why he was entitled to swear at them. In a time of crisis, some swearing is appropriate to convey urgency to the listener. At a nerd meetup? Hardly.
- burgerbrain 15y ago
  (The first part of your comment I have responded to above) I think that a lot what you are describing is heavily dependent upon the culture of the participants. Certainly in my culture "total disregard for even the most basic of social forums." would be a gross exaggeration and the rest of your comment would likely be perceived as far more insulting than the casual non-aggressive use of 'profanity'.
jsavimbi 15y ago
You'd be better served editing your other comment for grammar instead of debating the necessity and appropriateness of using profanity to convey emotion at a tech talk.
- burgerbrain 15y ago
  Excuse me? I am interested in engaging in mature dialog about the article, not getting into a grammar-nazi pissing match. If you have a worthwhile point to make in response to mine, then please do so. However I must ask you to refrain from posting unproductive comments like this.

nathanb 15y ago

I can't answer for jsavimbi, but I think it insults the audience because it takes the easy way out. It would be like not proofreading your slides and showing up with typos or txt abbrs rather than well-thought out phrases. Swearing works in private conversation for the same reason that other slang and spoken shortcuts work, and it works in casual written conversation for the same reason that abbreviations, shorthand, and inattention to capitalization, spelling, and punctuation work: there's no real expectation of quality. Sure it's lazy and shows a lack of caring, but if a friend is shooting me an email to ask if I'm up for Thai tonight, I don't expect her to proofread and capitalize before sending. That's an appropriate amount of effort for the situation. If you're putting that much effort into a presentation to someone you hope will give you money, however, that's just plain rude. (Some folks, and I suspect this is true for HN commenters at a much higher proportion than it is true for the general population, prefer to spend the time on all communication, regardless of formality or venue, to make it decent. I believe this is a good habit to cultivate, but I don't insist upon it in others).

jsavimbi 15y ago

It's an insult to pepper your audience with profanity when they took the time out of their day to pay attention to what you had to share. It shows that you did not take the time to properly prepare and present your arguments. It shows that you are immature. It shows that you have a complete and total disregard for even the most basic of social forums. And it shows that Mr. Holman is so self-absorbed that when confronted with what in polite society is considered ill-mannered and poorly timed swearing in a presentation, he doubled down and bereft of supervision decided to lecture the audience even further as to why he was entitled to swear at them. In a time of crisis, some swearing is appropriate to convey urgency to the listener. At a nerd meetup? Hardly.

burgerbrain 15y ago
(The first part of your comment I have responded to above) I think that a lot what you are describing is heavily dependent upon the culture of the participants. Certainly in my culture "total disregard for even the most basic of social forums." would be a gross exaggeration and the rest of your comment would likely be perceived as far more insulting than the casual non-aggressive use of 'profanity'.

jsavimbi 15y ago

You'd be better served editing your other comment for grammar instead of debating the necessity and appropriateness of using profanity to convey emotion at a tech talk.

burgerbrain 15y ago
Excuse me? I am interested in engaging in mature dialog about the article, not getting into a grammar-nazi pissing match. If you have a worthwhile point to make in response to mine, then please do so. However I must ask you to refrain from posting unproductive comments like this.