4 ms·

The FBI Forced a Suspect to Unlock Amazon’s Encrypted App Wickr with Their Face

30 points by cmg 4y ago

danhab99 4y ago
Is the horror of this situation the fact that biometric security is less secure than a memorized password, or the big-brother-esq coercion tactic they used?
- arthurcolle 4y ago
  Yes
- rocket_surgeron 4y ago
  Getting a warrant that is accessible for inspection by the public is not big-brother-esque. I see obtaining a warrant to place two objects (a face and a biometric security device) in proximity as more compatible with civil liberties than taking mugshots or fingerprints upon a suspect’s booking. The cost of a security should not exceed the value of the information you are protecting combined with the fallout of its disclosure. Face recognition is cheap, but my data are also worthless and every single utterance or act I’ve stored digitally would only generate boredom if disclosed. So it is fine to use faceid to protect my digital assets. Then again, I don’t trade in child pornography.
mikece 4y ago
Is this a stealth add for Amazon that not even they, when handed a warrant, can decrypt your Wickr data without Big Brother forcing a biometric unlock on you (or cutting you a plea deal to unlock the app so you can rat out the rest of your militia/gang/activists)?
- Forge36 4y ago
  It's a reminder to not use face verification and that proper password locking should occur after a period of time.
- ev1 4y ago
  Wasn't this the entire point of wickr in the first place?
dane-pgp 4y ago
I wonder if there are copyright implications here. Do you own the copyright to the image that your phone takes of your face? What about the data that is created when you initially register your biometric? Also, when the unlock process is checking for a match, is it creating a derivative work? Would this legal argument hold any more weight if you formally registered the copyright? (You'd think that two people taking two pictures of a vaguely similar public subject on different days could not amount to a copyright violation, but a court might disagree[0]). Finally, does someone registering (or unlocking a device with) their biometrics grant a licence to or even ownership of that data to the company who manufactured the device? It would be interesting if the FBI had to request permission from Apple to create a derivative work of "their" copy of your face stored in their/your device. [0] https://www.wpt.co.uk/resources/news/copyright-in-photographs--the-red-bus-case/ https://www.wpt.co.uk/resources/news/copyright-in-photograph...
jmprspret 4y ago
Since when does Wickr allow biomentrics for login? Last time I used it, it was username+password.
- orionion 4y ago
  > His Wickr account was locked with Apple’s Face ID facial recognition security.
  - jmprspret 4y ago
    Ah I see. I didn't read the article (clearly, lol).
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
dengxiaopeng 4y ago
This is quite similar to circumstances that happened in Columbus, OH a few years ago. Same app, same law enforcement tactic: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/10/doj-claims-its-warrant-forced-suspect-to-open-his-iphone-x-via-face-id/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/10/doj-claims-its-w...
antonymy 4y ago
Riding the bleeding edge has its risks in more ways than one. For now, law enforcement are taking full advantage to nail some easy targets with it. Wonder how long before this particular loophole is closed. Probably not until they start arresting people more sympathetic than pedophiles.
Hnrobert42 4y ago
I wonder if you could refuse to open your eyes.

30 points by cmg 4y ago

Is the horror of this situation the fact that biometric security is less secure than a memorized password, or the big-brother-esq coercion tactic they used?

arthurcolle 4y ago
Yes
rocket_surgeron 4y ago
Getting a warrant that is accessible for inspection by the public is not big-brother-esque. I see obtaining a warrant to place two objects (a face and a biometric security device) in proximity as more compatible with civil liberties than taking mugshots or fingerprints upon a suspect’s booking. The cost of a security should not exceed the value of the information you are protecting combined with the fallout of its disclosure. Face recognition is cheap, but my data are also worthless and every single utterance or act I’ve stored digitally would only generate boredom if disclosed. So it is fine to use faceid to protect my digital assets. Then again, I don’t trade in child pornography.

mikece 4y ago

Is this a stealth add for Amazon that not even they, when handed a warrant, can decrypt your Wickr data without Big Brother forcing a biometric unlock on you (or cutting you a plea deal to unlock the app so you can rat out the rest of your militia/gang/activists)?

Forge36 4y ago
It's a reminder to not use face verification and that proper password locking should occur after a period of time.
ev1 4y ago
Wasn't this the entire point of wickr in the first place?

dane-pgp 4y ago

I wonder if there are copyright implications here. Do you own the copyright to the image that your phone takes of your face? What about the data that is created when you initially register your biometric? Also, when the unlock process is checking for a match, is it creating a derivative work? Would this legal argument hold any more weight if you formally registered the copyright? (You'd think that two people taking two pictures of a vaguely similar public subject on different days could not amount to a copyright violation, but a court might disagree[0]). Finally, does someone registering (or unlocking a device with) their biometrics grant a licence to or even ownership of that data to the company who manufactured the device? It would be interesting if the FBI had to request permission from Apple to create a derivative work of "their" copy of your face stored in their/your device. [0] https://www.wpt.co.uk/resources/news/copyright-in-photographs--the-red-bus-case/ https://www.wpt.co.uk/resources/news/copyright-in-photograph...

jmprspret 4y ago

Since when does Wickr allow biomentrics for login? Last time I used it, it was username+password.

orionion 4y ago
> His Wickr account was locked with Apple’s Face ID facial recognition security.
- jmprspret 4y ago
  Ah I see. I didn't read the article (clearly, lol).

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

dengxiaopeng 4y ago

This is quite similar to circumstances that happened in Columbus, OH a few years ago. Same app, same law enforcement tactic: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/10/doj-claims-its-warrant-forced-suspect-to-open-his-iphone-x-via-face-id/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/10/doj-claims-its-w...

antonymy 4y ago

Riding the bleeding edge has its risks in more ways than one. For now, law enforcement are taking full advantage to nail some easy targets with it. Wonder how long before this particular loophole is closed. Probably not until they start arresting people more sympathetic than pedophiles.

Hnrobert42 4y ago

I wonder if you could refuse to open your eyes.