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Absolutely fascinating! Hope you didn't just make it all up /s

gennarro 4y ago
Had the same exact thought. Thank you!
btilly 4y ago
I did not make it up. The size of pterodactyls; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quetzalcoatlus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quetzalcoatlus Pterodactyls could fly from birth: https://www.newscientist.com/article/2284950-baby-pterosaurs-could-fly-within-minutes-of-hatching-from-their-eggs/ https://www.newscientist.com/article/2284950-baby-pterosaurs... And the bit on Resource Partitioning in https://www.khanacademy.org/science/ap-biology/ecology-ap/community-ecology/a/niches-competition https://www.khanacademy.org/science/ap-biology/ecology-ap/co... has the principle that in the presence of competition, animals focus on whatever niche lets them outcompete. But while I'm throwing out trivia on flight, have you ever wondered why bats only fly at night? It is because their wings have very thin skin. This is an even better aerodynamic surface than feathers, but offers them NO protection from sunburn!
- andrewflnr 4y ago
  Ok, but the key point is the causative link between wing structure and size, for which you have not cited anything. The only theory I've heard on that front is that being able to both launch and flap with their arms basically allowed them to use the same, larger muscles for both, rather than having to split them, which increased their size ceiling while still being able to launch. http://markwitton-com.blogspot.com/2018/05/why-we-think-giant-pterosaurs-could-fly.html?m=1 http://markwitton-com.blogspot.com/2018/05/why-we-think-gian... (This is more precisely answering the question "how could they get so big?", but still pretty germane.)
  - btilly 4y ago
    I didn't cite a causative link between wing structure and size. There were plenty of small pterosaurs. I cited a causative link between wing structure and parenting demands. And that is tied to the fact that babies can't fly if their wings don't support it. I have no idea from which article I ran across the connection between wing structure and juvenile flight. But the idea stuck because I was familiar with heterochrony from having read too much Stephen J. Gould when I was younger. However it is an observable fact that baby bats and birds do not fly, while fossil evidence says that pterosaurs did. The amount of parenting effort that birds require is also well-documented.
    - andrewflnr 4y ago
      That's great, honestly cool stuff, but the question you purported to be answering was: > Why did pterosaurs get so much bigger?

Had the same exact thought. Thank you!

I did not make it up. The size of pterodactyls; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quetzalcoatlus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quetzalcoatlus Pterodactyls could fly from birth: https://www.newscientist.com/article/2284950-baby-pterosaurs-could-fly-within-minutes-of-hatching-from-their-eggs/ https://www.newscientist.com/article/2284950-baby-pterosaurs... And the bit on Resource Partitioning in https://www.khanacademy.org/science/ap-biology/ecology-ap/community-ecology/a/niches-competition https://www.khanacademy.org/science/ap-biology/ecology-ap/co... has the principle that in the presence of competition, animals focus on whatever niche lets them outcompete. But while I'm throwing out trivia on flight, have you ever wondered why bats only fly at night? It is because their wings have very thin skin. This is an even better aerodynamic surface than feathers, but offers them NO protection from sunburn!

andrewflnr 4y ago
Ok, but the key point is the causative link between wing structure and size, for which you have not cited anything. The only theory I've heard on that front is that being able to both launch and flap with their arms basically allowed them to use the same, larger muscles for both, rather than having to split them, which increased their size ceiling while still being able to launch. http://markwitton-com.blogspot.com/2018/05/why-we-think-giant-pterosaurs-could-fly.html?m=1 http://markwitton-com.blogspot.com/2018/05/why-we-think-gian... (This is more precisely answering the question "how could they get so big?", but still pretty germane.)
- btilly 4y ago
  I didn't cite a causative link between wing structure and size. There were plenty of small pterosaurs. I cited a causative link between wing structure and parenting demands. And that is tied to the fact that babies can't fly if their wings don't support it. I have no idea from which article I ran across the connection between wing structure and juvenile flight. But the idea stuck because I was familiar with heterochrony from having read too much Stephen J. Gould when I was younger. However it is an observable fact that baby bats and birds do not fly, while fossil evidence says that pterosaurs did. The amount of parenting effort that birds require is also well-documented.
  - andrewflnr 4y ago
    That's great, honestly cool stuff, but the question you purported to be answering was: > Why did pterosaurs get so much bigger?