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I think you’re throwing the baby out with the bath water here. Sure depression may not be linked to low serotonin levels but it almost certainly some chemical i

I think you’re throwing the baby out with the bath water here. Sure depression may not be linked to low serotonin levels but it almost certainly some chemical imbalance of some variety.

bencollier49 4y ago
Metabolism and stress hormones both seem to play a role. It's going to be a very complex thing - the best treatment for a lot of brain conditions is just exercise.
- belorn 4y ago
  The key word when using exercise to treat stress is that it need to be voluntary (ie, something that the person want to do). Forcing oneself to exercise has the opposite result with increased corticosterone levels. Exercise is great if and only if the individual is doing something they enjoy.
sneak 4y ago
That's vague enough to be a totally useless description. Dehydration is also a "chemical imbalance of some variety".
- bergenty 4y ago
  I think that’s part of the point. Whatever it is, it’s a chemical imbalance. Just need to find which one. In the case of dehydration it’s water.
  - s1artibartfast 4y ago
    I think the point is anything can be a chemical process because we are chemical beings. Drowning or having your leg cut off leads to a chemical imbalance, but chemistry isn't always the most productive lens to analyze the problem
    - bergenty 4y ago
      Drowning or having your leg cut off are not chronic conditions. I think it makes a lot of sense to analyze chronic problems in the brain through the chemical lens.
      - s1artibartfast 4y ago
        >I think it makes a lot of sense to analyze chronic problems in the brain through the chemical lens. Thats the basically the point I am taking issue with. Myopic focus on chemistry can be terribly misleading. There will always be a chemical component because we are beings made up of chemical components. a chemical imbalance is by definition always going to be part of the problem. That does not mean it is always the best point of intervention, and certainly not the exclusive focus when trying to understand the problem.
        bergenty 4y ago
        There really isn’t a lot more going on in there though based on our current understanding of the brain. It’s neurons and synapses and all the neurotransmitters that regulate it all. What exactly are you suggesting could be the problem?
        s1artibartfast 4y ago
        This is the perfect example of myopic thinking coming from the chemical Focus If your only tool is a hammer then every problem looks like a nail. The brain is a lot more than chemistry, and that's not even looking at the human being and their interactions with the environment. there are patterns encoded in the structure and biology of the brain. There are psychological feedback loops and complicated interactions between a human and their environment. Saying it must be a chemical imbalance is akin to debugging a malfunctioning computer and saying it must be a signal error from a loose wire. It ignores programming sending signals on those wires and it ignores the input to the machine from the environment
kayodelycaon 4y ago
Or chemical imbalance is the symptom, not the cause.
niemal_dev 4y ago
Perhaps it's not a literal imbalance but more of a flow problem, neural pathways fail to deliver and a portion is lost along the way. There are so many ways this could be going wrong, we have absolutely no clue unless we devise proper tools and methodology for data-mining everything up to a satisfyingly objective level.

I think you’re throwing the baby out with the bath water here. Sure depression may not be linked to low serotonin levels but it almost certainly some chemical imbalance of some variety.

bencollier49 4y ago

Metabolism and stress hormones both seem to play a role. It's going to be a very complex thing - the best treatment for a lot of brain conditions is just exercise.

belorn 4y ago
The key word when using exercise to treat stress is that it need to be voluntary (ie, something that the person want to do). Forcing oneself to exercise has the opposite result with increased corticosterone levels. Exercise is great if and only if the individual is doing something they enjoy.

sneak 4y ago

That's vague enough to be a totally useless description. Dehydration is also a "chemical imbalance of some variety".

bergenty 4y ago
I think that’s part of the point. Whatever it is, it’s a chemical imbalance. Just need to find which one. In the case of dehydration it’s water.
- s1artibartfast 4y ago
  I think the point is anything can be a chemical process because we are chemical beings. Drowning or having your leg cut off leads to a chemical imbalance, but chemistry isn't always the most productive lens to analyze the problem
  - bergenty 4y ago
    Drowning or having your leg cut off are not chronic conditions. I think it makes a lot of sense to analyze chronic problems in the brain through the chemical lens.
    - s1artibartfast 4y ago
      >I think it makes a lot of sense to analyze chronic problems in the brain through the chemical lens. Thats the basically the point I am taking issue with. Myopic focus on chemistry can be terribly misleading. There will always be a chemical component because we are beings made up of chemical components. a chemical imbalance is by definition always going to be part of the problem. That does not mean it is always the best point of intervention, and certainly not the exclusive focus when trying to understand the problem.
      - bergenty 4y ago
        There really isn’t a lot more going on in there though based on our current understanding of the brain. It’s neurons and synapses and all the neurotransmitters that regulate it all. What exactly are you suggesting could be the problem?
        s1artibartfast 4y ago
        This is the perfect example of myopic thinking coming from the chemical Focus If your only tool is a hammer then every problem looks like a nail. The brain is a lot more than chemistry, and that's not even looking at the human being and their interactions with the environment. there are patterns encoded in the structure and biology of the brain. There are psychological feedback loops and complicated interactions between a human and their environment. Saying it must be a chemical imbalance is akin to debugging a malfunctioning computer and saying it must be a signal error from a loose wire. It ignores programming sending signals on those wires and it ignores the input to the machine from the environment

kayodelycaon 4y ago

Or chemical imbalance is the symptom, not the cause.

niemal_dev 4y ago

Perhaps it's not a literal imbalance but more of a flow problem, neural pathways fail to deliver and a portion is lost along the way. There are so many ways this could be going wrong, we have absolutely no clue unless we devise proper tools and methodology for data-mining everything up to a satisfyingly objective level.