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> on its way to become the standard low-level language It will take a very long time for Rust to get even close to the huge amount of C++ code out there. There

> on its way to become the standard low-level language It will take a very long time for Rust to get even close to the huge amount of C++ code out there. There are more than 5 million professional C++ developers employed around the world today. And that number is increasing. Don’t get me wrong: I like Rust and other attempts to move beyond C++. But don’t underestimate how much C++ code has been written the last 30+ years. And new C++ projects are started every single day. There are probably more C++ projects started every day than Rust projects. So anything that makes it possible to move beyond C++ while being 100% interoperable is good news.

zozbot234 4y ago
Carbon is not trying to be 100% interoperable with C++. It's trying for some fuzzy notion of "good enough" - that's really not very different from what Rust is trying to do with cxx-rs. Yes there are serious challenges and I've described them here, but they're not impossible to address while staying with Rust.
- lenkite 4y ago
  > Carbon is not trying to be 100% interoperable with C++ It's trying for some fuzzy notion of "good enough" No, it's clearly not a "fuzzy" notion of interop even in the most uncharitable interpretation. Your assertion is mis-information. "Seamless, bidirectional interoperability with C++, such that a library anywhere in an existing C++ stack can adopt Carbon without porting the rest." Support mixing Carbon and C++ toolchains Compatibility with the C++ memory model Minimize bridge code Unsurprising mappings between C++ and Carbon types Allow C++ bridge code in Carbon files Carbon inheritance from C++ types Support use of advanced C++ features Support basic C interoperability
  - zozbot234 4y ago
    And that's still not 100%. The Carbon devs are very clear that there will be some C++ code that Carbon is unable to interoperate with.
    - gulbanana 4y ago
      Like the standard library - they don't plan to support exceptions.
      - rkangel 4y ago
        Oh, that's excellent and interesting news - not a fan of exceptions. I'm not sure how that's going to work with interop when libraries rely on exceptions though. Where did you hear about this? I'd love to know more.
        google234123 4y ago
        You will probably have to write more c++ code to handle those exceptions inbetween

zozbot234 4y ago

Carbon is not trying to be 100% interoperable with C++. It's trying for some fuzzy notion of "good enough" - that's really not very different from what Rust is trying to do with cxx-rs. Yes there are serious challenges and I've described them here, but they're not impossible to address while staying with Rust.

lenkite 4y ago
> Carbon is not trying to be 100% interoperable with C++ It's trying for some fuzzy notion of "good enough" No, it's clearly not a "fuzzy" notion of interop even in the most uncharitable interpretation. Your assertion is mis-information. "Seamless, bidirectional interoperability with C++, such that a library anywhere in an existing C++ stack can adopt Carbon without porting the rest." Support mixing Carbon and C++ toolchains Compatibility with the C++ memory model Minimize bridge code Unsurprising mappings between C++ and Carbon types Allow C++ bridge code in Carbon files Carbon inheritance from C++ types Support use of advanced C++ features Support basic C interoperability
- zozbot234 4y ago
  And that's still not 100%. The Carbon devs are very clear that there will be some C++ code that Carbon is unable to interoperate with.
  - gulbanana 4y ago
    Like the standard library - they don't plan to support exceptions.
    - rkangel 4y ago
      Oh, that's excellent and interesting news - not a fan of exceptions. I'm not sure how that's going to work with interop when libraries rely on exceptions though. Where did you hear about this? I'd love to know more.
      - google234123 4y ago
        You will probably have to write more c++ code to handle those exceptions inbetween