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I have been predicting this for the past few years. Batteries shaped as shipping containers with container ships replacing spent batteries on shipping ports the

I have been predicting this for the past few years. Batteries shaped as shipping containers with container ships replacing spent batteries on shipping ports they visit is the future for shipping.

epistasis 4y ago
And throw them on trains for electric freight without having to run expensive catenaries. Shipping containers full of batteries are the basic shape of current grid storage too, which is growing exponentially even if it's only in the 10s of GW per year right now (corresponding to 4x the GWh, usually, but grid resources are typically defined primarily by their power rather than energy.) Being able to place a shipping container of battery next to a distribution center to avoid an upgrade to transmission and distribution will also enable tons of savings on electricity grid costs, as transmission and distribution must be sized to peak capacity, and which often results in extremely low average usage of the expensive resource. In most places in the US, transmission and distribution is a bigger cost that the generation of electricity. Storage is going to change everything, and the naysayers who make up fake "physics" to pretend it can't work have already been proven very wrong.
- sofixa 4y ago
  > And throw them on trains for electric freight without having to run expensive catenaries I'd love to see the math on this, because I can't imagine it will cost less than electrifying railways (at least the heavily used ones) over a prolonged period of time (say, a decade or two). Batteries need to be swapped out which will waste time, and replaced every so often. Catenaries need maintenance and have a high upfront cost, but still..
- bluGill 4y ago
  https://pedestrianobservations.com/2022/07/13/in-motion-charging-is-not-for-trains/ https://pedestrianobservations.com/2022/07/13/in-motion-char... Is a good discussion on why catenary is better than batteries for trains.
  - ZeroGravitas 4y ago
    I generally agree that city centre busses are a better target than trains (or long distance coaches) but its a matter of degree. As batteries get cheaper and better, the comparison to wires alters. Even electrical grids, whose whole business is moving electricity on wires are installing batteries to avoid the expense of wires in certain situations. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-wires_alternatives https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-wires_alternatives It's not a binary thing and the balance is relentlessly moving towards batteries over time.

I have been predicting this for the past few years. Batteries shaped as shipping containers with container ships replacing spent batteries on shipping ports they visit is the future for shipping.

epistasis 4y ago

And throw them on trains for electric freight without having to run expensive catenaries. Shipping containers full of batteries are the basic shape of current grid storage too, which is growing exponentially even if it's only in the 10s of GW per year right now (corresponding to 4x the GWh, usually, but grid resources are typically defined primarily by their power rather than energy.) Being able to place a shipping container of battery next to a distribution center to avoid an upgrade to transmission and distribution will also enable tons of savings on electricity grid costs, as transmission and distribution must be sized to peak capacity, and which often results in extremely low average usage of the expensive resource. In most places in the US, transmission and distribution is a bigger cost that the generation of electricity. Storage is going to change everything, and the naysayers who make up fake "physics" to pretend it can't work have already been proven very wrong.

sofixa 4y ago
> And throw them on trains for electric freight without having to run expensive catenaries I'd love to see the math on this, because I can't imagine it will cost less than electrifying railways (at least the heavily used ones) over a prolonged period of time (say, a decade or two). Batteries need to be swapped out which will waste time, and replaced every so often. Catenaries need maintenance and have a high upfront cost, but still..
bluGill 4y ago
https://pedestrianobservations.com/2022/07/13/in-motion-charging-is-not-for-trains/ https://pedestrianobservations.com/2022/07/13/in-motion-char... Is a good discussion on why catenary is better than batteries for trains.
- ZeroGravitas 4y ago
  I generally agree that city centre busses are a better target than trains (or long distance coaches) but its a matter of degree. As batteries get cheaper and better, the comparison to wires alters. Even electrical grids, whose whole business is moving electricity on wires are installing batteries to avoid the expense of wires in certain situations. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-wires_alternatives https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-wires_alternatives It's not a binary thing and the balance is relentlessly moving towards batteries over time.