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> In my publicity campaign, I suggested the presence of the gun, especially in light of recent space team psychological problems, might be an invitation to a fu

> In my publicity campaign, I suggested the presence of the gun, especially in light of recent space team psychological problems, might be an invitation to a future disaster. The problem with guns is that they are designed for one clear purpose, someone that gets into some mental problem may see one and get ideas.

efitz 4y ago
If an astronaut develops a mental health problem in space, what’s going to stop them from opening the hatch or probably a thousand other things that would result in the deaths of everyone aboard? Guns are just a distraction in this case, or more precisely, removal of guns from this situation doesn’t seem to meaningfully reduce risk. That said, I have no idea why astronauts need guns; they’re unlikely to encounter hostile humans or animals and shooting isn’t a practical hobby in space. Maybe in case they land in a bad neighborhood or wilderness? In that case, why not just store the guns on the outside of the landing module, making the guns difficult (and obvious) to access while in space.
- grogenaut 4y ago
  Have guns been tested for those temperature swings, or the primers and other explosive components? Do they off gas in zero atmosphere?
  - thatguy0900 4y ago
    You could always store the ammo separately
- jmillikin 4y ago
  > That said, I have no idea why astronauts need guns; they’re > unlikely to encounter hostile humans or animals The fine article, and Wikipedia's page on the same firearm[0], describe it as intended for wilderness survival in the event the crew capsule had to land in the Soviet tundra. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TP-82_Cosmonaut_survival_pistol https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TP-82_Cosmonaut_survival_pisto...
- almog 4y ago
  >probably a thousand other things that would result in the deaths of everyone aboard? Guns are just a distraction in this case, or more precisely, removal of guns from this situation doesn’t seem to meaningfully reduce risk I imagine that many of these things would involve either: 1. More steps/time to execute than pulling the trigger on a gun, thus leave more time for the rest of the crew to react. 2. Or require more planning than pulling the trigger on a gun and thus more chance to rethink one's plan + a chance to recover from that mental health problem as well as higher chance that the rest of the crew will be able to assess the mental health problem and treat it. At either case, I don't see how _having access_ to a device that can functions as a death switch would not be considered at least a meaningful risk to the space vessel or its crew.
  - LanceH 4y ago
    Starting a fire would be easy, not obvious and devastating. It wouldn't be difficult to have the gun be completely unavailable until landing.
    - almog 4y ago
      > Starting a fire would be easy, not obvious and devastating. I'm not sure how starting a fire would be non-obvious but, in general, fire prevention, detection and suppression a risk that space crews are well trained to deal with, regardless of sabotage. > It wouldn't be difficult to have the gun be completely unavailable until landing. Agree, but: 1. That is not the case that's described here. 2. My argument was to counter the claim that having access to a gun onboard a spaceship does not significantly increase the overall risk to crew members.
  - hourago 4y ago
    You are trying to be reasonable and informed taking with the pro-gun crowd, you deserved to be upvoted.
    - kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 4y ago
      Actually, they're attempting to force an agenda into a reasonable conversation about a reasonable case of gun use. But at least, unlike you, they're not being a complete jerk and adding nothing.
- jaywalk 4y ago
  While I'm sure there are plenty of ways a determined astronaut could wreak havoc on the ISS, opening the hatch isn't one of them. Much like on an airplane, the pressure differential makes it impossible to open when the inside is pressurized and the outside is not.
  - stevenjgarner 4y ago
    Do we know for sure there are no weapons on the ISS?
  - efitz 4y ago
    Uh, on an airplane, you absolutely CAN open the door at altitude because the pressure inside is greater than outside. I think you’re thinking of submarines, where the higher pressure outside holds the hatches shut.
    - sundowners 4y ago
      That's why Submarine hatches are conical and open out, and airplane hatches open in. The pressure differential keeps them closed. Yes, the plane door eventually pivots out of the hole and hands on the outside but it first had to move inside the cabin a little bit
- marssaxman 4y ago
  > Maybe in case they land in a bad neighborhood or wilderness? Exactly this, and this is why it was a Soviet/Russian practice - their spacecraft make ground landings, instead of splashing down at sea. In fact, when the Voskhod 2 navigation system failed, it landed in a wilderness area so remote the men on board had to spend two nights in the snow before rescue. One of these cosmonauts was Alexei Leonov, who went on to a leadership position in the cosmonaut program: the survival gun was his initiative.
- maest 4y ago
  > If an astronaut develops a mental health problem in space, what’s going to stop them from opening the hatch or probably a thousand other things that would result in the deaths of everyone aboard? Guns are just a distraction in this case, or more precisely, removal of guns from this situation doesn’t seem to meaningfully reduce risk And yet, in countries with higher levels of gun ownership, lethal assault occurrences are higher.
  - hourago 4y ago
    Yes. Guns increase the amount of killings. Too have a gun in a controlled place like a space station was craziness and a catastrophe waiting to happen. I understand that some people like guns, but their lack of acceptance of the consequences is childish. I guess that so many shootings were kids die have created a cognitive dissonance on many gun owners. They want to see guns as "only for good" meanwhile kids die.
wrp 4y ago
>...in light of recent space team psychological problems... I saw this reasoning and thought, "OK, what about the survival knife, or potentially lethal pieces of rope, or in fact any small pointy thing like a screwdriver?" Also consider that they are in a fragile environment where a deranged individual could do considerable damage with just bare hands.

efitz 4y ago

If an astronaut develops a mental health problem in space, what’s going to stop them from opening the hatch or probably a thousand other things that would result in the deaths of everyone aboard? Guns are just a distraction in this case, or more precisely, removal of guns from this situation doesn’t seem to meaningfully reduce risk. That said, I have no idea why astronauts need guns; they’re unlikely to encounter hostile humans or animals and shooting isn’t a practical hobby in space. Maybe in case they land in a bad neighborhood or wilderness? In that case, why not just store the guns on the outside of the landing module, making the guns difficult (and obvious) to access while in space.

grogenaut 4y ago
Have guns been tested for those temperature swings, or the primers and other explosive components? Do they off gas in zero atmosphere?
- thatguy0900 4y ago
  You could always store the ammo separately
jmillikin 4y ago
> That said, I have no idea why astronauts need guns; they’re > unlikely to encounter hostile humans or animals The fine article, and Wikipedia's page on the same firearm[0], describe it as intended for wilderness survival in the event the crew capsule had to land in the Soviet tundra. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TP-82_Cosmonaut_survival_pistol https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TP-82_Cosmonaut_survival_pisto...
almog 4y ago
>probably a thousand other things that would result in the deaths of everyone aboard? Guns are just a distraction in this case, or more precisely, removal of guns from this situation doesn’t seem to meaningfully reduce risk I imagine that many of these things would involve either: 1. More steps/time to execute than pulling the trigger on a gun, thus leave more time for the rest of the crew to react. 2. Or require more planning than pulling the trigger on a gun and thus more chance to rethink one's plan + a chance to recover from that mental health problem as well as higher chance that the rest of the crew will be able to assess the mental health problem and treat it. At either case, I don't see how _having access_ to a device that can functions as a death switch would not be considered at least a meaningful risk to the space vessel or its crew.
- LanceH 4y ago
  Starting a fire would be easy, not obvious and devastating. It wouldn't be difficult to have the gun be completely unavailable until landing.
  - almog 4y ago
    > Starting a fire would be easy, not obvious and devastating. I'm not sure how starting a fire would be non-obvious but, in general, fire prevention, detection and suppression a risk that space crews are well trained to deal with, regardless of sabotage. > It wouldn't be difficult to have the gun be completely unavailable until landing. Agree, but: 1. That is not the case that's described here. 2. My argument was to counter the claim that having access to a gun onboard a spaceship does not significantly increase the overall risk to crew members.
- hourago 4y ago
  You are trying to be reasonable and informed taking with the pro-gun crowd, you deserved to be upvoted.
  - kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 4y ago
    Actually, they're attempting to force an agenda into a reasonable conversation about a reasonable case of gun use. But at least, unlike you, they're not being a complete jerk and adding nothing.
jaywalk 4y ago
While I'm sure there are plenty of ways a determined astronaut could wreak havoc on the ISS, opening the hatch isn't one of them. Much like on an airplane, the pressure differential makes it impossible to open when the inside is pressurized and the outside is not.
- stevenjgarner 4y ago
  Do we know for sure there are no weapons on the ISS?
- efitz 4y ago
  Uh, on an airplane, you absolutely CAN open the door at altitude because the pressure inside is greater than outside. I think you’re thinking of submarines, where the higher pressure outside holds the hatches shut.
  - sundowners 4y ago
    That's why Submarine hatches are conical and open out, and airplane hatches open in. The pressure differential keeps them closed. Yes, the plane door eventually pivots out of the hole and hands on the outside but it first had to move inside the cabin a little bit
marssaxman 4y ago
> Maybe in case they land in a bad neighborhood or wilderness? Exactly this, and this is why it was a Soviet/Russian practice - their spacecraft make ground landings, instead of splashing down at sea. In fact, when the Voskhod 2 navigation system failed, it landed in a wilderness area so remote the men on board had to spend two nights in the snow before rescue. One of these cosmonauts was Alexei Leonov, who went on to a leadership position in the cosmonaut program: the survival gun was his initiative.
maest 4y ago
> If an astronaut develops a mental health problem in space, what’s going to stop them from opening the hatch or probably a thousand other things that would result in the deaths of everyone aboard? Guns are just a distraction in this case, or more precisely, removal of guns from this situation doesn’t seem to meaningfully reduce risk And yet, in countries with higher levels of gun ownership, lethal assault occurrences are higher.
- hourago 4y ago
  Yes. Guns increase the amount of killings. Too have a gun in a controlled place like a space station was craziness and a catastrophe waiting to happen. I understand that some people like guns, but their lack of acceptance of the consequences is childish. I guess that so many shootings were kids die have created a cognitive dissonance on many gun owners. They want to see guns as "only for good" meanwhile kids die.

wrp 4y ago

>...in light of recent space team psychological problems... I saw this reasoning and thought, "OK, what about the survival knife, or potentially lethal pieces of rope, or in fact any small pointy thing like a screwdriver?" Also consider that they are in a fragile environment where a deranged individual could do considerable damage with just bare hands.