4 ms·

I like the idea of ASCII diagram editors but... Mac only and doesn't actually use ASCII as it's format? However shiny it's interface may be that seems to defeat

by tomxor 4y ago

I like the idea of ASCII diagram editors but... Mac only and doesn't actually use ASCII as it's format? However shiny it's interface may be that seems to defeat the purpose of the portability you are supposed to get. I've been using https://asciiflow.com/#/ https://asciiflow.com/#/ to make and edit simple diagrams, it's fairly basic but sufficient for 90% of what I want so far. But would be happy to discover other editors (this is text, after all, lockin is impossible.)

shagie 4y ago
In a recent exploration of the domain, textik.com is rather bare bones, but does have some interesting features. In particular, it recognizes certain spots on the border of a rectangle as connection points. Drawing a line between two connection points establishes that similar to how drawing programs handle lines - including the "if you drag that rectangle around now, the lines connected to the connection points adjust too."
andrewingram 4y ago
I'm not sure what you mean by not using ASCII as its format. It lets you export as plain (ASCII) text, but the document format for the app itself also needs to keep hold of all the additional metadata related to vector shapes and groups. So it follows that the plain text representation isn't going to be sufficient to model such a document.
- tomxor 4y ago
  > It lets you export as plain (ASCII) text, but the document format for the app itself also needs to keep hold of all the additional metadata related to vector shapes and groups. Yes this is exactly what I mean, exporting ASCII != using ASCII as the format. ASCII flow (although substantially less featureful) shows that it is possible to do reasonable shape inference directly from ASCII, and frankly this is preferable to lugging a load of proprietary application documents around with your ASCII diagrams (even though it's obviously more limited)... otherwise why bother with ASCII.
  - andrewingram 4y ago
    The inference in Asciiflow is quite impressive. From my perspective it falls a little short of providing a great experience, but each to their own.
dingleberry420 4y ago
I really like asciiflow except for its arrow handling. Not sure why, but drawing the following appears to be impossible: ─┬─ │ ▲ │ ─┴─ Instead you will always get: ─┬─ │ ▼ │ ─┴─ Even using the freeform tool to fix the arrow doesn't work. I've searched, and haven't found any other decent ascii editors that run on Linux. Any pointers would be very welcome.
- numen 4y ago
  There's a tool called JavE, which was quite good 13 years ago: http://www.jave.de/developer/milestone6rc2.html http://www.jave.de/developer/milestone6rc2.html While it is quite feature-packed, its character set is limited to actual ASCII.
masukomi 4y ago
It generates ASCII, or svg, or png or a variety of things. Who cares what format it stores it in. The things you generate with it are totally portable. You may as well complain that we shouldn't write code in interpreted languages like Ruby and Perl and node because they're _also_ not portable to anyone who doesn't have the interpreter installed. But heck, compiled languages like Go and C are also not portable unless you've got the compiler installed. Only their artifacts are. We may as well abandon this whole programming thing. Or, maybe... maybe things can still be incredibly useful even if it's only their artifacts that are portable.
- tomxor 4y ago
  The format is proprietary; source encoding and almost all PLs are not. I can install Ruby, you can install Ruby, for free, or even write my own interpreter... I cannot install Monodraw, even with money. A big part of the lure of ASCII drawings is portability and openness on the same level as plain text.

by tomxor 4y ago

shagie 4y ago

In a recent exploration of the domain, textik.com is rather bare bones, but does have some interesting features. In particular, it recognizes certain spots on the border of a rectangle as connection points. Drawing a line between two connection points establishes that similar to how drawing programs handle lines - including the "if you drag that rectangle around now, the lines connected to the connection points adjust too."

andrewingram 4y ago

I'm not sure what you mean by not using ASCII as its format. It lets you export as plain (ASCII) text, but the document format for the app itself also needs to keep hold of all the additional metadata related to vector shapes and groups. So it follows that the plain text representation isn't going to be sufficient to model such a document.

tomxor 4y ago
> It lets you export as plain (ASCII) text, but the document format for the app itself also needs to keep hold of all the additional metadata related to vector shapes and groups. Yes this is exactly what I mean, exporting ASCII != using ASCII as the format. ASCII flow (although substantially less featureful) shows that it is possible to do reasonable shape inference directly from ASCII, and frankly this is preferable to lugging a load of proprietary application documents around with your ASCII diagrams (even though it's obviously more limited)... otherwise why bother with ASCII.
- andrewingram 4y ago
  The inference in Asciiflow is quite impressive. From my perspective it falls a little short of providing a great experience, but each to their own.

dingleberry420 4y ago

I really like asciiflow except for its arrow handling. Not sure why, but drawing the following appears to be impossible: ─┬─ │ ▲ │ ─┴─ Instead you will always get: ─┬─ │ ▼ │ ─┴─ Even using the freeform tool to fix the arrow doesn't work. I've searched, and haven't found any other decent ascii editors that run on Linux. Any pointers would be very welcome.

numen 4y ago
There's a tool called JavE, which was quite good 13 years ago: http://www.jave.de/developer/milestone6rc2.html http://www.jave.de/developer/milestone6rc2.html While it is quite feature-packed, its character set is limited to actual ASCII.

masukomi 4y ago

It generates ASCII, or svg, or png or a variety of things. Who cares what format it stores it in. The things you generate with it are totally portable. You may as well complain that we shouldn't write code in interpreted languages like Ruby and Perl and node because they're _also_ not portable to anyone who doesn't have the interpreter installed. But heck, compiled languages like Go and C are also not portable unless you've got the compiler installed. Only their artifacts are. We may as well abandon this whole programming thing. Or, maybe... maybe things can still be incredibly useful even if it's only their artifacts that are portable.

tomxor 4y ago
The format is proprietary; source encoding and almost all PLs are not. I can install Ruby, you can install Ruby, for free, or even write my own interpreter... I cannot install Monodraw, even with money. A big part of the lure of ASCII drawings is portability and openness on the same level as plain text.