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You’re making an interesting point here. I’m resistant to it because some analysis I do (say, inferring atmospheric composition from the spectra of light you s
by mturmon 4y ago
You’re making an interesting point here.
I’m resistant to it because some analysis I do (say, inferring atmospheric composition from the spectra of light you shine through the atmosphere) does fit rather well in the Bayesian setup. In a very real sense, if you are doing a bunch of these inversions and not using Bayesian methods, you are leaving RMSE on the table.
Here, the “features” are the spectra you sense and you add some basic prior information based on historical expectations. You don’t have that much wiggle room to invent new variables to confuse the analysis.
But the situation changes if you have woolier problems with human judgement in finding “features” — the variables in the prior or likelihood in the spam example you give. And you can fool yourself badly!
E.g., to go with your market example, I have two models for the stock market, and 1 month of historical data strongly favors model 1 over model 2, so I bet heavily on model 1 as if that’s the only possibility. But it wasn’t, and I lose.
The area of causal inference uses a slightly different set of tools that gets outside the Bayesian setup, including the Do() operator, which allows for manual intervention to probe the linkages in systems like these. There’s a lot of activity there as we’re looking for systems that learn reliably.
I don’t know if you listen to podcasts, but Judea Pearl was recently on Sean Carroll’s (excellent) Mindscape podcast. They discuss this at some length, it was very nice.
https://www.preposterousuniverse.com/podcast/2022/05/09/196-judea-pearl-on-cause-and-effect/ https://www.preposterousuniverse.com/podcast/2022/05/09/196-...
PS: it’s enjoyable to see your comments here.
- lisper 4y agoHi Mike! :-) Thanks for the kind words. I don't know much about atmospheric science, but the canonical "real" example of Bayesian reasoning is a diagnostic test for some disease, where you are told that X% of the population has the disease, where X is typically a small number, so the "surprising" result is that your odds of having the disease are low even if you test positive and the test is generally accurate. The problem is: how can you possibly know what percentage of the population has the disease? To determine that you'd need a reliable test, but there is no such test. That's the whole point! If there were a 100% reliable test you wouldn't need to do any math.
- mturmon 4y agoSometimes called the "Bayesian dogma of precision" -- to any state of nature, you can assign a crisp probability (e.g., https://sipta.org https://sipta.org). For your disease example -- if you don't know the accuracy of the test ("the model"), and/or if you can't figure out what percent of the population has the disease ("the prior"), then you can't turn the Bayesian crank. Yet, some do, because Bayesian good.