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Many people had concerns about the vaccine rollout. Not because we were worried about some 5G nanoparticle Bill Gates conspiracy nonsense but because of the pot

Many people had concerns about the vaccine rollout. Not because we were worried about some 5G nanoparticle Bill Gates conspiracy nonsense but because of the potential unknown side effects. Doing a trial on a few hundred thousand and then rolling out to billions is like testing your changes locally and then pushing them straight to production. "But human bodies are not anything like software dev" I hear you say. You're right. Biology is way more complicated and we know less about the mechanics of our own bodies than the computers we designed. If we go forward assuming everything we do is infallible and silencing anybody with concerns, someday we will have a real disaster.

mint2 4y ago
The vaccines were heavily politicized and the politicizing of them was not coming from a place of legitimate concerns, clearly shown by the same groups embracing snake oil cures with the only info backing them making the vaccine studies look like the most thorough studies ever done in the history of humanity. There were No worries about side effects for the sketchy snake oil.
dennis_jeeves1 4y ago
> someday we will have a real disaster. Real disasters always happen, but it happens to 'other' individuals, so no one is bothered.
planarhobbit 4y ago
> Biology is way more complicated and we know less about the mechanics of our own bodies than the computers we designed. We don’t know much about that either, to be fair.
throwaway0a5e 4y ago
>If we go forward assuming everything we do is infallible and silencing anybody with concerns, someday we will have a real disaster. And if we go down this road hopefully it's sooner rather than later. The people responsible should have to live (or not) through the suck rather than having some yet unknown future generation be saddled with cleaning up the mess.
lelandfe 4y ago
> because of the potential unknown side effects Without trying to inflame the rhetoric in this discussion (I feel like HN is one of the few places that this is possible) – will this be your stance on new vaccines and medicines going forward? "Potential unknown side effects" is a critique that can be levied against almost any medical approval process, but the FDA has had an excellent track record with vaccine safety over the last ~70 years.
- LinuxBender 4y ago
  Just anecdotally I can only speak for myself but I have stayed clear of vaccines for 29 years after the military used experimental vaccines on me and I never doubted or regretted my decision. I instead focus on keeping my innate and adaptive immune systems incredibly strong. This requires discipline and dedication to a strict diet and moderate exercise and is why I suspect that many people are opposed to this way of life. There are a million rabbit hole arguments for and against what I am doing but I am happy with the path I am on.
  - ChrisRR 4y ago
    Just out of interest, how do you mean used experimental vaccines on you? Is this something you opted in to?
    - LinuxBender 4y ago
      I had adverse reactions to their vaccines. When I inquired as the ingredients I was advised it was classified. I ran into the "It's classified" wall a few times.
- macinjosh 4y ago
  > the FDA has had an excellent track record with vaccine safety over the last ~70 years Yeah, and they did this by going through a lot of detailed processes, study, and trial. Not by doing what was done in this case.
  - deleted 4y ago
altarius 4y ago
On the other hand, I'm surprised how few people are worried at all about taking the COVID-19 antivirals.
kaba0 4y ago
What if you know that prod has a huge vulnerability actively being exploited. Will you wait for the QA to finish manual testing of the UI, or push the solution ASAP after the CICD pipeline turns green? Still not a good analogy, but perhaps closer to the case.

mint2 4y ago

The vaccines were heavily politicized and the politicizing of them was not coming from a place of legitimate concerns, clearly shown by the same groups embracing snake oil cures with the only info backing them making the vaccine studies look like the most thorough studies ever done in the history of humanity. There were No worries about side effects for the sketchy snake oil.

dennis_jeeves1 4y ago

> someday we will have a real disaster. Real disasters always happen, but it happens to 'other' individuals, so no one is bothered.

planarhobbit 4y ago

> Biology is way more complicated and we know less about the mechanics of our own bodies than the computers we designed. We don’t know much about that either, to be fair.

throwaway0a5e 4y ago

>If we go forward assuming everything we do is infallible and silencing anybody with concerns, someday we will have a real disaster. And if we go down this road hopefully it's sooner rather than later. The people responsible should have to live (or not) through the suck rather than having some yet unknown future generation be saddled with cleaning up the mess.

lelandfe 4y ago

> because of the potential unknown side effects Without trying to inflame the rhetoric in this discussion (I feel like HN is one of the few places that this is possible) – will this be your stance on new vaccines and medicines going forward? "Potential unknown side effects" is a critique that can be levied against almost any medical approval process, but the FDA has had an excellent track record with vaccine safety over the last ~70 years.

LinuxBender 4y ago
Just anecdotally I can only speak for myself but I have stayed clear of vaccines for 29 years after the military used experimental vaccines on me and I never doubted or regretted my decision. I instead focus on keeping my innate and adaptive immune systems incredibly strong. This requires discipline and dedication to a strict diet and moderate exercise and is why I suspect that many people are opposed to this way of life. There are a million rabbit hole arguments for and against what I am doing but I am happy with the path I am on.
- ChrisRR 4y ago
  Just out of interest, how do you mean used experimental vaccines on you? Is this something you opted in to?
  - LinuxBender 4y ago
    I had adverse reactions to their vaccines. When I inquired as the ingredients I was advised it was classified. I ran into the "It's classified" wall a few times.
macinjosh 4y ago
> the FDA has had an excellent track record with vaccine safety over the last ~70 years Yeah, and they did this by going through a lot of detailed processes, study, and trial. Not by doing what was done in this case.
- deleted 4y ago

altarius 4y ago

On the other hand, I'm surprised how few people are worried at all about taking the COVID-19 antivirals.

kaba0 4y ago

What if you know that prod has a huge vulnerability actively being exploited. Will you wait for the QA to finish manual testing of the UI, or push the solution ASAP after the CICD pipeline turns green? Still not a good analogy, but perhaps closer to the case.