5 ms·

OpenVMS v9.2 for x86 is Available

unixhero 4y ago
Hobbyist license in the future when more compilers are available. Why in the world are they waiting to provide it? A symbol of a clueless corporate leadership.
- icedchai 4y ago
  The compilers aren’t done yet. They’re using cross compilers running on Itanium.
  - ch_123 4y ago
    This, in turn, is because they are converting the compilers from a proprietary code generator to LLVM.
    - hulitu 4y ago
      Huh ? OpenVMS does not have a native compiler ?
      - icedchai 4y ago
        It does, on Itanium, Alpha, and VAX. My understanding from looking at VMS Software's web site is that the native compilers for x86-64, for more well known languages like C++, are still in testing: https://vmssoftware.com/about/news/2022-07-08-state-of-the-92-release-ready/ https://vmssoftware.com/about/news/2022-07-08-state-of-the-9...
  - unixhero 4y ago
    My point is that why are they delaying a hobbyist license, just because the compilers aren't ready. It doesn't make sense.
    - icedchai 4y ago
      Previous hobbyist distributions (for Alpha and VAX, at least, not sure about Itanium) included compilers. Certainly, it will be much more useful to hobbyists if compilers are available.
      - unixhero 4y ago
        Compilers can be installed as software packages, these can be downloaded after the base install is completed. Or maybe VMS does not have s concept of installing software packages at all. What do I know. Their decision to delay still doesn't make sense.
        icedchai 4y ago
        Of course, it has packages. Personally, I think an OS without compilers is less than useful for hobbyists. I mean, what are you going to run on it? It's a new architecture so there aren't many existing programs. I'd prefer they wait and provide a more complete distribution. In the meantime, we are all free to install older versions on Alpha or VAX emulators.
    - tinus_hn 4y ago
      You are complaining they don’t release a half baked product for free. And if they did other people would be complaining it’s half baked and doesn’t work with a free compiler. They are free to release nothing at all for free, be grateful for what you get.
      - unixhero 4y ago
        Yes I am complaining. Who are we? Who are hobbyists any way? We are the ones who do R&D for free, who deliver software testing for free, who take our skills into the workforce and recommend technologies as solutions. We should be treated as first class citizens. And yes _of course_ operating systems should be free to hackers and hobbyists, for the reasons outlined above.
egberts1 4y ago
Why not make it available to hobbyists so that hobbyists can shove all the compilers into it. This isn't a chicken-or-egg dilemma there.
- hakfoo 4y ago
  Maybe they figure supplying their own (commercial) compilers to hobby users, will discourage the growth of, say, a GCC ecosystem that will be much harder to sell to big commercial clients.
  - egberts1 4y ago
    Kinda looking like that there.
- ch_123 4y ago
  The compilers for VMS have to deal with a bunch of platform idiosyncrasies, such as the ability to have a mix of 32-bit and 64-bit pointers in the one program.
natas 4y ago
Other than Ikea, why would a company run this as opposed to Linux or whatever? I understand clustering is cool, feels like a mainframe of sorts, I can probably come close to that with kubernetes. What are the other compelling arguments, there is no software for this platform that isn't readily available for Linux. ELI5 me.

Hobbyist license in the future when more compilers are available. Why in the world are they waiting to provide it? A symbol of a clueless corporate leadership.

icedchai 4y ago
The compilers aren’t done yet. They’re using cross compilers running on Itanium.
- ch_123 4y ago
  This, in turn, is because they are converting the compilers from a proprietary code generator to LLVM.
  - hulitu 4y ago
    Huh ? OpenVMS does not have a native compiler ?
    - icedchai 4y ago
      It does, on Itanium, Alpha, and VAX. My understanding from looking at VMS Software's web site is that the native compilers for x86-64, for more well known languages like C++, are still in testing: https://vmssoftware.com/about/news/2022-07-08-state-of-the-92-release-ready/ https://vmssoftware.com/about/news/2022-07-08-state-of-the-9...
- unixhero 4y ago
  My point is that why are they delaying a hobbyist license, just because the compilers aren't ready. It doesn't make sense.
  - icedchai 4y ago
    Previous hobbyist distributions (for Alpha and VAX, at least, not sure about Itanium) included compilers. Certainly, it will be much more useful to hobbyists if compilers are available.
    - unixhero 4y ago
      Compilers can be installed as software packages, these can be downloaded after the base install is completed. Or maybe VMS does not have s concept of installing software packages at all. What do I know. Their decision to delay still doesn't make sense.
      - icedchai 4y ago
        Of course, it has packages. Personally, I think an OS without compilers is less than useful for hobbyists. I mean, what are you going to run on it? It's a new architecture so there aren't many existing programs. I'd prefer they wait and provide a more complete distribution. In the meantime, we are all free to install older versions on Alpha or VAX emulators.
  - tinus_hn 4y ago
    You are complaining they don’t release a half baked product for free. And if they did other people would be complaining it’s half baked and doesn’t work with a free compiler. They are free to release nothing at all for free, be grateful for what you get.
    - unixhero 4y ago
      Yes I am complaining. Who are we? Who are hobbyists any way? We are the ones who do R&D for free, who deliver software testing for free, who take our skills into the workforce and recommend technologies as solutions. We should be treated as first class citizens. And yes _of course_ operating systems should be free to hackers and hobbyists, for the reasons outlined above.

egberts1 4y ago

Why not make it available to hobbyists so that hobbyists can shove all the compilers into it. This isn't a chicken-or-egg dilemma there.

hakfoo 4y ago
Maybe they figure supplying their own (commercial) compilers to hobby users, will discourage the growth of, say, a GCC ecosystem that will be much harder to sell to big commercial clients.
- egberts1 4y ago
  Kinda looking like that there.
ch_123 4y ago
The compilers for VMS have to deal with a bunch of platform idiosyncrasies, such as the ability to have a mix of 32-bit and 64-bit pointers in the one program.

natas 4y ago

Other than Ikea, why would a company run this as opposed to Linux or whatever? I understand clustering is cool, feels like a mainframe of sorts, I can probably come close to that with kubernetes. What are the other compelling arguments, there is no software for this platform that isn't readily available for Linux. ELI5 me.