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But as this current crisis clearly shows, the problem is not privacy invasion by FANGs. The problem is government privacy invasion, everywhere. And there, sorry

But as this current crisis clearly shows, the problem is not privacy invasion by FANGs. The problem is government privacy invasion, everywhere. And there, sorry to say, Google is not the problem. Perhaps some changes to their policies is warranted, but a total turnaround? Why? Hospitals and doctor's effectively report on women's periods, contraceptives and pregnancies when women visit. This is not optional, this is important for correct diagnosis and care for women, as well as for emergency care for women when necessary (many drugs and life-saving treatments, including emergency ones, MUST NOT be used during pregnancies, not because religion, but because they would harm the baby, or mother, or both). And unlike Google searches, Facebook chats or Amazon orders, medical provided information about periods has actually been used to convict women getting abortions. Something similar goes for social workers providing women with feminine hygiene products. The first thing we need is for police to stay away from medical records, and to go back to outlawing doctors, and any medical and social services (esp. mental care of any kind) giving any information to the police. But that would this information is inaccessible to law enforcement and the next time some teenager disappears for a week we'd need to show backbone ... The next divorce proceedings we need to show backbone, and WHATEVER mental health history any of the partners have needs to stay out of it. We need to make police, justice, some medical procedures and social work harder, and accept the costs that will come with that.

mschuster91 4y ago
> But as this current crisis clearly shows, the problem is not privacy invasion by FANGs. The problem is government privacy invasion, everywhere. And there, sorry to say, Google is not the problem. I literally said that boycotting Google and period apps is a stopgap solution and the real fix is to get rights to privacy enshrined in constitutions?
briHass 4y ago
Just to note that separating medical records from government's prying eyes would also include (lack of) vaccination status and would neuter most 'red flag' laws that restrict gun access based on mental health.
- tristor 4y ago
  Sounds like a positive outcome. Vaccination status is something between the patient and the doctor, the police have no need for that information. Red flag laws are both blatantly unconstitutional and have been wildly misused in their short time in existence, the only people I see defending them are mostly those who see it as an inch towards a complete personal gun ownership ban, which is what they really want. Doctor/Patient confidentiality used to be sacrosanct, and it is no longer, and realistically I know many people who refuse help because of this. The Defund the Police folks are right, America needs more social workers, not more police powers.
  - mschuster91 4y ago
    > Red flag laws are both blatantly unconstitutional and have been wildly misused in their short time in existence, the only people I see defending them are mostly those who see it as an inch towards a complete personal gun ownership ban, which is what they really want. The US has a problem with gun violence that puts all other civilized nations to shame, and it is per 100k second in the world when it comes to firearm suicide [1]. The problem is, getting any sort of federal gun control that actually reduces the amount of gun violence passed in Congress is impossible. Even right after yet another completely preventable massacre - firearm death is the most common source of child deaths [2]. So, yes, states need to be able to institute limitations on gun use, and "red flag" laws that use either known records of mental health issues or (domestic) violence citations are a reasonable compromise between privacy and the right of children to go to school without getting shot dead. [1] https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-deaths-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-death... [2] https://time.com/6170864/cause-of-death-children-guns/ https://time.com/6170864/cause-of-death-children-guns/
    - tristor 4y ago
      So, to clarify, you are confirming that you are against personal firearms ownership and also support red flag laws as a compromise/inch towards a ban. I don’t understand why you’re replying like we are going to engage in a debate here.
nobodyandproud 4y ago
> Google is not the problem. Perhaps some changes to their policies is warranted, but a total turnaround? Why? But it is the problem. Google legally collects the data, but that means the information is only one law away from becoming accessible and directly used against individuals. There are many checks in place—practical, legal, and cultural—to keep law enforcement from collecting such data. FAANG’s surveillance tech has created a backdoor to circumvent all but the legal checks. That’s an awful place to be in, especially in the world of parallel construction.
- pessimizer 4y ago
  Google is a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pen_register https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pen_register which is the way around privacy law. > Twelve years [after Katz v. United States] the Supreme Court held that a pen register is not a search because the "petitioner voluntarily conveyed numerical information to the telephone company." Smith v. Maryland, 442 U.S. 735, 744 (1979). Since the defendant had disclosed the dialed numbers to the telephone company so they could connect his call, he did not have a reasonable expectation of privacy in the numbers he dialed. The court did not distinguish between disclosing the numbers to a human operator or just the automatic equipment used by the telephone company.

mschuster91 4y ago

> But as this current crisis clearly shows, the problem is not privacy invasion by FANGs. The problem is government privacy invasion, everywhere. And there, sorry to say, Google is not the problem. I literally said that boycotting Google and period apps is a stopgap solution and the real fix is to get rights to privacy enshrined in constitutions?

briHass 4y ago

Just to note that separating medical records from government's prying eyes would also include (lack of) vaccination status and would neuter most 'red flag' laws that restrict gun access based on mental health.

tristor 4y ago
Sounds like a positive outcome. Vaccination status is something between the patient and the doctor, the police have no need for that information. Red flag laws are both blatantly unconstitutional and have been wildly misused in their short time in existence, the only people I see defending them are mostly those who see it as an inch towards a complete personal gun ownership ban, which is what they really want. Doctor/Patient confidentiality used to be sacrosanct, and it is no longer, and realistically I know many people who refuse help because of this. The Defund the Police folks are right, America needs more social workers, not more police powers.
- mschuster91 4y ago
  > Red flag laws are both blatantly unconstitutional and have been wildly misused in their short time in existence, the only people I see defending them are mostly those who see it as an inch towards a complete personal gun ownership ban, which is what they really want. The US has a problem with gun violence that puts all other civilized nations to shame, and it is per 100k second in the world when it comes to firearm suicide [1]. The problem is, getting any sort of federal gun control that actually reduces the amount of gun violence passed in Congress is impossible. Even right after yet another completely preventable massacre - firearm death is the most common source of child deaths [2]. So, yes, states need to be able to institute limitations on gun use, and "red flag" laws that use either known records of mental health issues or (domestic) violence citations are a reasonable compromise between privacy and the right of children to go to school without getting shot dead. [1] https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-deaths-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-death... [2] https://time.com/6170864/cause-of-death-children-guns/ https://time.com/6170864/cause-of-death-children-guns/
  - tristor 4y ago
    So, to clarify, you are confirming that you are against personal firearms ownership and also support red flag laws as a compromise/inch towards a ban. I don’t understand why you’re replying like we are going to engage in a debate here.

nobodyandproud 4y ago

> Google is not the problem. Perhaps some changes to their policies is warranted, but a total turnaround? Why? But it is the problem. Google legally collects the data, but that means the information is only one law away from becoming accessible and directly used against individuals. There are many checks in place—practical, legal, and cultural—to keep law enforcement from collecting such data. FAANG’s surveillance tech has created a backdoor to circumvent all but the legal checks. That’s an awful place to be in, especially in the world of parallel construction.

pessimizer 4y ago
Google is a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pen_register https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pen_register which is the way around privacy law. > Twelve years [after Katz v. United States] the Supreme Court held that a pen register is not a search because the "petitioner voluntarily conveyed numerical information to the telephone company." Smith v. Maryland, 442 U.S. 735, 744 (1979). Since the defendant had disclosed the dialed numbers to the telephone company so they could connect his call, he did not have a reasonable expectation of privacy in the numbers he dialed. The court did not distinguish between disclosing the numbers to a human operator or just the automatic equipment used by the telephone company.