5 ms·

> I remember reading an article a while back about how something as ubiquitous as a cheeseburger is only possible with wide, nation-crossing supply chains. I'm

by mmmpop 4y ago

> I remember reading an article a while back about how something as ubiquitous as a cheeseburger is only possible with wide, nation-crossing supply chains. I'm the article was informative but I know where a few cows are and I know how to at least field dress a carcass, so I bet I can wrangle me some hamburger.

School-Cotton 4y ago
Sure, but >90% of people don’t have whatever upbringing (or interests/hobbies) that led you to have that knowledge, so at a population scale the point stands.
smackeyacky 4y ago
I'm sure you can, but it doesn't scale. The only way we eat is industrialised agriculture. You will be fighting your neighbours for that cow and wasting most of it. Similarly with "backyard plots" and that other great modern stupidity, the vertical indoor garden. Like anybody will be lazily reaching over to pick a tomato from their indoor vertical garden instead of the monstrous greenhouses that most tomatoes come from these days.
- lovich 4y ago
  I agree with you that we rely on industrial agriculture and the amount of space someone needs to fully feed themselves is larger than most peoples available space, but I and others totally reach for the shit we grow before resorting to buying in a store, I don’t know why you think that can’t subsidize some need for shipping food
  - smackeyacky 4y ago
    For basics like potatoes, carrots, onions etc. this is possibly doable but it isn't going to replace a families worth of food. For an individual or a couple, maybe. But certainly not all year. If you use the old-school Australian "quarter acre block" you might do a families vegetables for part of the year. As a supplement, it's worthwhile. As a substitute it's non viable.
- Retric 4y ago
  In WWII home gardens roughly doubled fresh vegetable production. The degree to which they’re a good idea personally varies quite a bit, but backyards represent a lot of viable farmland on a national scale.
  - lostlogin 4y ago
    If I take the local example - the city was built where it is due to the local conditions being good, including great, volcanic soil. Then the city grew and houses were built all over the good soil, pushing agriculture further out. The last market garden in the area became a housing subdivision about 5 years ago.
  - gruez 4y ago
    > In WWII home gardens roughly doubled fresh vegetable production. but at what cost? "The $64 Tomato" comes to mind.
  - wyager 4y ago
    > In WWII home gardens roughly doubled fresh vegetable production. This is obviously not true in any meaningful sense. I assume this is based on "fresh" restricting the numbers to a meaninglessly small fraction of total production. It doesn't even make sense within an order of magnitude.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - Retric 4y ago
      In the US it was 18 million victory gardens out of a population of 140 million people. They really did represent a lot of land and a lot of labor. In absolute numbers they allowed a 50% increase in total vegetable production over farms alone in the US. Fresh in this context referred to the amount of canning going on. So they made a very significant difference to diets of people domestically.
      - wyager 4y ago
- TheGigaChad 4y ago
hn_throwaway_99 4y ago
A cheeseburger is much more than just beef. The article highlighted that getting beef, cheese, fresh lettuce, tomato, etc., a bun, seasonings and condiments all at the same time is what required a larger supply chain.

by mmmpop 4y ago

School-Cotton 4y ago

Sure, but >90% of people don’t have whatever upbringing (or interests/hobbies) that led you to have that knowledge, so at a population scale the point stands.

smackeyacky 4y ago

I'm sure you can, but it doesn't scale. The only way we eat is industrialised agriculture. You will be fighting your neighbours for that cow and wasting most of it. Similarly with "backyard plots" and that other great modern stupidity, the vertical indoor garden. Like anybody will be lazily reaching over to pick a tomato from their indoor vertical garden instead of the monstrous greenhouses that most tomatoes come from these days.

lovich 4y ago
I agree with you that we rely on industrial agriculture and the amount of space someone needs to fully feed themselves is larger than most peoples available space, but I and others totally reach for the shit we grow before resorting to buying in a store, I don’t know why you think that can’t subsidize some need for shipping food
- smackeyacky 4y ago
  For basics like potatoes, carrots, onions etc. this is possibly doable but it isn't going to replace a families worth of food. For an individual or a couple, maybe. But certainly not all year. If you use the old-school Australian "quarter acre block" you might do a families vegetables for part of the year. As a supplement, it's worthwhile. As a substitute it's non viable.
Retric 4y ago
In WWII home gardens roughly doubled fresh vegetable production. The degree to which they’re a good idea personally varies quite a bit, but backyards represent a lot of viable farmland on a national scale.
- lostlogin 4y ago
  If I take the local example - the city was built where it is due to the local conditions being good, including great, volcanic soil. Then the city grew and houses were built all over the good soil, pushing agriculture further out. The last market garden in the area became a housing subdivision about 5 years ago.
- gruez 4y ago
  > In WWII home gardens roughly doubled fresh vegetable production. but at what cost? "The $64 Tomato" comes to mind.
- wyager 4y ago
  > In WWII home gardens roughly doubled fresh vegetable production. This is obviously not true in any meaningful sense. I assume this is based on "fresh" restricting the numbers to a meaninglessly small fraction of total production. It doesn't even make sense within an order of magnitude.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - Retric 4y ago
    In the US it was 18 million victory gardens out of a population of 140 million people. They really did represent a lot of land and a lot of labor. In absolute numbers they allowed a 50% increase in total vegetable production over farms alone in the US. Fresh in this context referred to the amount of canning going on. So they made a very significant difference to diets of people domestically.
    - wyager 4y ago
TheGigaChad 4y ago

hn_throwaway_99 4y ago

A cheeseburger is much more than just beef. The article highlighted that getting beef, cheese, fresh lettuce, tomato, etc., a bun, seasonings and condiments all at the same time is what required a larger supply chain.