4 ms·

The cooling gases in ACs also leak over time, and contain very strong greenhouse gases. It's not only energy use.

by Scarblac 4y ago

dtech 4y ago
As far as I know, modern appliances use gasses without this problem. It also holds for fridges.
- Scarblac 4y ago
  As far as I know, gases that cause holes in the ozone layer aren't used anymore, but they're still extremely strong greenhouse gases (recent newspaper article I read mentioned 2000x CO2).
- sdflhasjd 4y ago
  There is a move to more environmentally friendly gasses, but the new gasses are still in the hundreds of times Co2 equivalent (Down from thousands)
  - g8oz 4y ago
    This is the move: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kigali_Amendment https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kigali_Amendment
- throw0101a 4y ago
  >> The cooling gases in ACs also leak over time, and contain very strong greenhouse gases. > As far as I know, modern appliances use gasses without this problem. It also holds for fridges. Completely wrong, and the exact opposite of reality. The currently-used gases are such a problem that the plan is to phase them out for new one in the upcoming years. Just do a search for "R410a phase out". > Because of the global warming potential of many HFC refrigerants, the latest amendment to the Montreal Protocol, the Kigali Amendment, has proposed to phase-down the use of refrigerants such as R-410A. The phase down is expected to begin sometime in the 2020’s. The leading replacement for R-410A refrigerant is a pure, single component refrigerant called R-32, which has one-third the global warming potential of R‑410A. * https://www.goodmanmfg.com/resources/hvac-learning-center/hvac-101/the-refrigerant-story-from-r-22-to-r-410a https://www.goodmanmfg.com/resources/hvac-learning-center/hv... One possible replacement is R-32: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Difluoromethane https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Difluoromethane Automotive AC has already moved to HFO-1234yf (from R-134a, Freon): * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2,3,3,3-Tetrafluoropropene https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2,3,3,3-Tetrafluoropropene
  - politelemon 4y ago
    How can I find out if my fridge uses R410A?
    - throw0101a 4y ago
      It may be in the manual, or on a sticker on the system (along with electrical information (voltages, currents)). > An increasingly important environmental concern is the disposal of old refrigerators—initially because freon coolant damages the ozone layer—but as older generation refrigerators wear out, the destruction of CFC-bearing insulation also causes concern. Modern refrigerators usually use a refrigerant called HFC-134a (1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane), which does not deplete the ozone layer, unlike Freon. R-134a is becoming much rarer in Europe. Newer refrigerants are being used instead. The main refrigerant now used is R-600a, or isobutane which has a smaller effect on the atmosphere if released. * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refrigerator#Disposal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refrigerator#Disposal * https://homeaffluence.com/what-coolants-are-primarily-used-in-refrigerators/ https://homeaffluence.com/what-coolants-are-primarily-used-i...
kolinko 4y ago
If I'm not mistaken, an average AC contains 200kg-1 ton CO2 equivalent gas. Assuming we have one AC installation per person in developed countries, and each installation releases its full contents once every ten years, it would increase the carbon footprint of people in developed nations from ~10T/yr to ~10.02-10.1T a year. Don't get me wrong - we should minimise the release of such gases and find better gases for AC, but it is not a significant issue right now.

The cooling gases in ACs also leak over time, and contain very strong greenhouse gases. It's not only energy use.

dtech 4y ago

As far as I know, modern appliances use gasses without this problem. It also holds for fridges.

Scarblac 4y ago
As far as I know, gases that cause holes in the ozone layer aren't used anymore, but they're still extremely strong greenhouse gases (recent newspaper article I read mentioned 2000x CO2).
sdflhasjd 4y ago
There is a move to more environmentally friendly gasses, but the new gasses are still in the hundreds of times Co2 equivalent (Down from thousands)
- g8oz 4y ago
  This is the move: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kigali_Amendment https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kigali_Amendment
throw0101a 4y ago
>> The cooling gases in ACs also leak over time, and contain very strong greenhouse gases. > As far as I know, modern appliances use gasses without this problem. It also holds for fridges. Completely wrong, and the exact opposite of reality. The currently-used gases are such a problem that the plan is to phase them out for new one in the upcoming years. Just do a search for "R410a phase out". > Because of the global warming potential of many HFC refrigerants, the latest amendment to the Montreal Protocol, the Kigali Amendment, has proposed to phase-down the use of refrigerants such as R-410A. The phase down is expected to begin sometime in the 2020’s. The leading replacement for R-410A refrigerant is a pure, single component refrigerant called R-32, which has one-third the global warming potential of R‑410A. * https://www.goodmanmfg.com/resources/hvac-learning-center/hvac-101/the-refrigerant-story-from-r-22-to-r-410a https://www.goodmanmfg.com/resources/hvac-learning-center/hv... One possible replacement is R-32: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Difluoromethane https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Difluoromethane Automotive AC has already moved to HFO-1234yf (from R-134a, Freon): * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2,3,3,3-Tetrafluoropropene https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2,3,3,3-Tetrafluoropropene
- politelemon 4y ago
  How can I find out if my fridge uses R410A?
  - throw0101a 4y ago
    It may be in the manual, or on a sticker on the system (along with electrical information (voltages, currents)). > An increasingly important environmental concern is the disposal of old refrigerators—initially because freon coolant damages the ozone layer—but as older generation refrigerators wear out, the destruction of CFC-bearing insulation also causes concern. Modern refrigerators usually use a refrigerant called HFC-134a (1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane), which does not deplete the ozone layer, unlike Freon. R-134a is becoming much rarer in Europe. Newer refrigerants are being used instead. The main refrigerant now used is R-600a, or isobutane which has a smaller effect on the atmosphere if released. * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refrigerator#Disposal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refrigerator#Disposal * https://homeaffluence.com/what-coolants-are-primarily-used-in-refrigerators/ https://homeaffluence.com/what-coolants-are-primarily-used-i...

kolinko 4y ago

If I'm not mistaken, an average AC contains 200kg-1 ton CO2 equivalent gas. Assuming we have one AC installation per person in developed countries, and each installation releases its full contents once every ten years, it would increase the carbon footprint of people in developed nations from ~10T/yr to ~10.02-10.1T a year. Don't get me wrong - we should minimise the release of such gases and find better gases for AC, but it is not a significant issue right now.