4 ms·

Young children may benefit from having more male teachers

25 points by lxm 4y ago

bediger4000 4y ago
- rexpop 4y ago
  > It's traditional [that X], stands to reason that [X is] the best. Wow, I am simply horrified to see such medieval notions expressed in a technology forum. Even if it weren't a fallacy to conclude such, it's based on an absurd, faulty premise! Even in our highly patriarchal society, men play very important tutelage roles — not only teaching patriarchically acceptable subjects like woodworking, hunting, outdoor survival skills, and sport, but also what you might recognize as purely academic subjects like math, science, literature, or history. In fact, the more I think about it, the more patently absurd your quaint assertions appear! There a was a time in your "traditional" tradition when tutelage was the exclusive purview of men!
- codefreeordie 4y ago
  Poe's law is a bitch. I have to just ask, is this satire or not?
  - bediger4000 4y ago
    [flagged]
    - codefreeordie 4y ago
      I'll take that as a yes. Thanks.
    - smt88 4y ago
      The problem with these "jokes" (other than not being funny and failing to be more enlightening than the non-sarcastic version) is that HN actually has people who feel this way. Maybe you can use sarcasm on monoculture subreddits, but HN often has people chiming in who actually are stuck in 1950.
      - codefreeordie 4y ago
        I suppose they may exist, but the follow-up reply here doesn't sound like any actual conservative I have ever encountered. Even the original statement was pretty far outside any common conservative viewpoint (which is why I asked if it was satire). This reads like what a typical liberal activist thinks conservatives sound like or believe, rather than what they actually say or believe.
0xy 4y ago
This is especially important for boys, considering female teachers arbitrarily mark their work lower based on their gender. [1] [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/education-31751672 https://www.bbc.com/news/education-31751672
MarkMc 4y ago
> Ms Schaede suggests that quota men may simply have been better at the job than marginal women. Male and female teachers differ. Men were more likely to speak Finnish as their mother tongue and to have studied mathematics. Perhaps these or other characteristics helped their teaching. > In other words, the selection criteria for teachers may have elevated candidates who were less suitable—exactly the outcome critics of quotas fear. I don't understand this second paragraph. If men are better at the job and the quota elevated men, how can you conclude that "the selection criteria for teachers may have elevated candidates who were less suitable"?
- fakethenews2022 4y ago
  With the quota removed, the selection criteria for teachers ended up with worse student outcomes. The opposite should have happened because removing the quota should have resulted in better teachers on the margin. Therefore they suggested perhaps the selection criteria did not consider some criteria such as mathematics background or native language expertise that was more often found in men (the group favored in the quota). If this is the case, they should add these as criteria, student outcomes would improve, and the gender disparity would decrease. It isn't that students benefit from having more male teachers. It is that the selection criteria was choosing marginal women over men who actually were better teachers.
- faeriechangling 4y ago
  The "selection criteria" being referred to is the system without the quota. This is simply poor writing.
TbobbyZ 4y ago
It’s difficult to get male teachers cause pay is terrible. It’s more difficult as a man to find the woman you desire if you make low pay.
- _xerces_ 4y ago
  Sounds like a very odd, incel thing to say.
  - TbobbyZ 4y ago
    Why? Women very rarely date down at the economic level. Last time I checked, mate options are important for males.
    - _xerces_ 4y ago
      Talk of "mate options" is not how most normal people approach relationships. Also, language discussing and finding a woman you desire being difficult if you don't make a lot of money is just odd and incelly as it casts the aspersion that all women are mercurial. It also paints women as objects of desire and not people with personalities, interests, dreams and a rich life - according to your language they're mercurial mate options. I just think you could have phrased things a little better.

25 points by lxm 4y ago

rexpop 4y ago
> It's traditional [that X], stands to reason that [X is] the best. Wow, I am simply horrified to see such medieval notions expressed in a technology forum. Even if it weren't a fallacy to conclude such, it's based on an absurd, faulty premise! Even in our highly patriarchal society, men play very important tutelage roles — not only teaching patriarchically acceptable subjects like woodworking, hunting, outdoor survival skills, and sport, but also what you might recognize as purely academic subjects like math, science, literature, or history. In fact, the more I think about it, the more patently absurd your quaint assertions appear! There a was a time in your "traditional" tradition when tutelage was the exclusive purview of men!
codefreeordie 4y ago
Poe's law is a bitch. I have to just ask, is this satire or not?
- bediger4000 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - codefreeordie 4y ago
    I'll take that as a yes. Thanks.
  - smt88 4y ago
    The problem with these "jokes" (other than not being funny and failing to be more enlightening than the non-sarcastic version) is that HN actually has people who feel this way. Maybe you can use sarcasm on monoculture subreddits, but HN often has people chiming in who actually are stuck in 1950.
    - codefreeordie 4y ago
      I suppose they may exist, but the follow-up reply here doesn't sound like any actual conservative I have ever encountered. Even the original statement was pretty far outside any common conservative viewpoint (which is why I asked if it was satire). This reads like what a typical liberal activist thinks conservatives sound like or believe, rather than what they actually say or believe.

0xy 4y ago

This is especially important for boys, considering female teachers arbitrarily mark their work lower based on their gender. [1] [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/education-31751672 https://www.bbc.com/news/education-31751672

MarkMc 4y ago

> Ms Schaede suggests that quota men may simply have been better at the job than marginal women. Male and female teachers differ. Men were more likely to speak Finnish as their mother tongue and to have studied mathematics. Perhaps these or other characteristics helped their teaching. > In other words, the selection criteria for teachers may have elevated candidates who were less suitable—exactly the outcome critics of quotas fear. I don't understand this second paragraph. If men are better at the job and the quota elevated men, how can you conclude that "the selection criteria for teachers may have elevated candidates who were less suitable"?

fakethenews2022 4y ago
With the quota removed, the selection criteria for teachers ended up with worse student outcomes. The opposite should have happened because removing the quota should have resulted in better teachers on the margin. Therefore they suggested perhaps the selection criteria did not consider some criteria such as mathematics background or native language expertise that was more often found in men (the group favored in the quota). If this is the case, they should add these as criteria, student outcomes would improve, and the gender disparity would decrease. It isn't that students benefit from having more male teachers. It is that the selection criteria was choosing marginal women over men who actually were better teachers.
faeriechangling 4y ago
The "selection criteria" being referred to is the system without the quota. This is simply poor writing.

TbobbyZ 4y ago

It’s difficult to get male teachers cause pay is terrible. It’s more difficult as a man to find the woman you desire if you make low pay.

_xerces_ 4y ago
Sounds like a very odd, incel thing to say.
- TbobbyZ 4y ago
  Why? Women very rarely date down at the economic level. Last time I checked, mate options are important for males.
  - _xerces_ 4y ago
    Talk of "mate options" is not how most normal people approach relationships. Also, language discussing and finding a woman you desire being difficult if you don't make a lot of money is just odd and incelly as it casts the aspersion that all women are mercurial. It also paints women as objects of desire and not people with personalities, interests, dreams and a rich life - according to your language they're mercurial mate options. I just think you could have phrased things a little better.