4 ms·

One word comes to mind when I think of free roaming robots - Jawas. As a kid, a slightly distressing part of Star Wars was R2D2 getting zapped by a band of cut

One word comes to mind when I think of free roaming robots - Jawas. As a kid, a slightly distressing part of Star Wars was R2D2 getting zapped by a band of cute but spooky-eyed scavengers who kidnap and sell robots for spare parts! Robots may survive in well lit, surveilled streets of Earth's cities, but they won't need to wander as far as outer-rim desert world of Tatooine to get into trouble. A situation much like the early days of network hacking, but in the real physical world is latent. Despite benevolent anthropomorphism, robots aren't much loved by humans. They're packed with valuable electronics. But much more fun... they can be captured, hacked to perform the bidding of a new master and released back into circulation. Iran capturing the RQ-170 stealth drone in 2011 was almost inevitable but portends a new frontier in digital defence in physical space. Ultimately this leads to robots that can "defend themselves", and so to the obvious escalation of force between humans and machines. For this reason I predict that, like domesticated dogs, robots have limited room to rove, close to protective masters.

samizdis 4y ago
> Despite benevolent anthropomorphism, robots aren't much loved by humans. That brings to mind the hitchBOT [1] experiment from 2013 to 2015. It did well - helped by media attention - in parts of Europe and Canada, but later came to grief in Philadelphia [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HitchBOT https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HitchBOT [2] HN comment thread on HitchBOT destroyed in Philadelphia, ending U.S. tour https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9990881 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9990881
okasaki 4y ago
I'm not sure you can compare military drones flying in hostile airspace* to robo dogs in your neighbourhood. After all real dogs and cats usually aren't in danger of kidnapping even though you could sell them or eat them or something. Indeed if they're anything like real animals, the biggest danger will be inattentive drivers. * Have you considered not flying your military drones over other countries?
- technothrasher 4y ago
  > the biggest danger will be inattentive drivers. I suspect the bigger danger will be vandalism. I will admit that the robots that wander my local grocery store looking for messes to clean up (or at least to alert humans to) make me irrationally angry. They get in my way and distract my attention, and it makes me want to just kick the *$%# out of them. I suspect I'm not the only one who feels this way, and the more robots get 'out in the environment' without anybody watching out for them, the more people will damage them on purpose.
  - azekai 4y ago
    This gives me the heebie-jeebies. I repair machines for a living, and the idea of smashing a complex mechanical system just to vent seems so alien.
    - ThalesX 4y ago
      I’ve had my self-whatever vacuum and mop for awhile now and I still look at it proudly as it mops the house. I do feel a sort of spirit in the machine for these new AI gadgets, even though I am aware of the reality of it.
speeder 4y ago
Not the type of machine that can wander but... Brazil has some experience with people being nasty to machines. 1. Robotic bank tellers (atm): we had a huge crime wave where people would literally blow them up to steal contents. It got so violent that some places refused to have one nearby, some explosions demolished buildings, and gun battles sometimes happened, one of them even involved people using anti-material sniper rifles and left the surroundings completely demolished and several corpses destroyed in gory ways (like people cut in half by bullets) 2. Only places where you can play arcade games are very secure (like airports), I asked a manufacturer about it, and he said any arcade game in a bar for example invariably get destroyed as people steal its components (chips, cables, etc... people steal the valuable silicon parts for sale, and the metallic ones like cables and connectors to melt down)
- samizdis 4y ago
  > Robotic bank tellers (atm): we had a huge crime wave where people would literally blow them up to steal contents. The method of choice in my part of the world is to use a JCB (or other brand of digger). Just a cursory search will show examples such as [1] and [2] in England and [3] in Ireland. From [2] (with my apologies for it being the Daily Mail): There have also been a spate of similar robberies elsewhere in the country. In November thieves used a digger to smash through the brick wall of Warner's Budgens in Moreton-in-Marsh, Gloucestershire, before fleeing the scene with the ATM. In the same month, thieves pulled away bricks leaving a gaping hole in the side of a Co-op supermarket in Sapcote, Leicestershire, which took just 20 seconds. Similar to the robbery in York, the digger was left at the scene. Thieves also ploughed a stolen JCB digger in to a Marks & Spencer store before stealing the cash machine at Malvern Retail Park in Worcestershire. [1] (England) https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/jcb-thieves-ram-raid-barclays-olney-milton-keynes-a8468571.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/jcb-thieves-ram-raid-b... [2] (England) https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2921779/Now-s-hole-wall-Thieves-use-JCB-digger-rip-cash-machine-op-supermarket-overnight-raid.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2921779/Now-s-hole-... [3] (Ireland) https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2022/0304/1284407-atm/ https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2022/0304/1284407-atm/
eddieroger 4y ago
>For this reason I predict that, like domesticated dogs, robots have limited room to rove, close to protective masters. Maybe, but robots will have something that domesticated dogs, and their wild counterparts, don't have - the ability to communicate and effectively (perfectly?) share information. Just like a driver would ask a gas station attendant for directions, a lost robot could ask a local one for information on its surroundings and use that to plot a course. My Roomba may not need to leave my house, but it could tell a passing delivery bot when it has arrived at what I consider my front door.
goodpoint 4y ago
> They're packed with valuable electronics ... they can be captured Why people fuel this fantasy of roaming robots being stolen? Of all valuable things that can be stolen, old cars are the easiest choice for a thief and robots are the worst. An AI device filled to the brim with sensors, cameras, GPS and with remote connectivity is the perfect go-to-prison card. > Ultimately this leads to robots that can "defend themselves", and so to the obvious escalation of force between humans and machines. Is this scifi worldbuilding or reality? No, your new car is not going to incinerate thieves like in Robocop 2.
- Rygian 4y ago
  > An AI device filled to the brim with sensors, cameras, GPS and with remote connectivity Is therefore filled to the brim with valuables that an old car doesn't have. Take for example the ZiGGY [1]. I predict that within 24 hours of it being in service, someone will lift one of them into a van, drive away with it to an abandoned shed, and tear it down for the batteries inside, before the owner can do anything about it. [1] https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20220614005357/en/EV-Safe-Charge-Previews-ZiGGY%E2%84%A2-First-and-Only-Mobile-EV-Charging-Robot-with-Interactive-Advertising-Platform https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20220614005357/en/EV-...
  - goodpoint 4y ago
    >> An AI device filled to the brim with sensors, cameras, GPS and with remote connectivity >Is therefore filled to the brim with valuables that an old car doesn't have. Because cameras and GPSes are expensive now? Is a phone more expensive than car from 20 years ago then?

samizdis 4y ago

> Despite benevolent anthropomorphism, robots aren't much loved by humans. That brings to mind the hitchBOT [1] experiment from 2013 to 2015. It did well - helped by media attention - in parts of Europe and Canada, but later came to grief in Philadelphia [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HitchBOT https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HitchBOT [2] HN comment thread on HitchBOT destroyed in Philadelphia, ending U.S. tour https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9990881 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9990881

okasaki 4y ago

I'm not sure you can compare military drones flying in hostile airspace* to robo dogs in your neighbourhood. After all real dogs and cats usually aren't in danger of kidnapping even though you could sell them or eat them or something. Indeed if they're anything like real animals, the biggest danger will be inattentive drivers. * Have you considered not flying your military drones over other countries?

technothrasher 4y ago
> the biggest danger will be inattentive drivers. I suspect the bigger danger will be vandalism. I will admit that the robots that wander my local grocery store looking for messes to clean up (or at least to alert humans to) make me irrationally angry. They get in my way and distract my attention, and it makes me want to just kick the *$%# out of them. I suspect I'm not the only one who feels this way, and the more robots get 'out in the environment' without anybody watching out for them, the more people will damage them on purpose.
- azekai 4y ago
  This gives me the heebie-jeebies. I repair machines for a living, and the idea of smashing a complex mechanical system just to vent seems so alien.
  - ThalesX 4y ago
    I’ve had my self-whatever vacuum and mop for awhile now and I still look at it proudly as it mops the house. I do feel a sort of spirit in the machine for these new AI gadgets, even though I am aware of the reality of it.

speeder 4y ago

Not the type of machine that can wander but... Brazil has some experience with people being nasty to machines. 1. Robotic bank tellers (atm): we had a huge crime wave where people would literally blow them up to steal contents. It got so violent that some places refused to have one nearby, some explosions demolished buildings, and gun battles sometimes happened, one of them even involved people using anti-material sniper rifles and left the surroundings completely demolished and several corpses destroyed in gory ways (like people cut in half by bullets) 2. Only places where you can play arcade games are very secure (like airports), I asked a manufacturer about it, and he said any arcade game in a bar for example invariably get destroyed as people steal its components (chips, cables, etc... people steal the valuable silicon parts for sale, and the metallic ones like cables and connectors to melt down)

samizdis 4y ago
> Robotic bank tellers (atm): we had a huge crime wave where people would literally blow them up to steal contents. The method of choice in my part of the world is to use a JCB (or other brand of digger). Just a cursory search will show examples such as [1] and [2] in England and [3] in Ireland. From [2] (with my apologies for it being the Daily Mail): There have also been a spate of similar robberies elsewhere in the country. In November thieves used a digger to smash through the brick wall of Warner's Budgens in Moreton-in-Marsh, Gloucestershire, before fleeing the scene with the ATM. In the same month, thieves pulled away bricks leaving a gaping hole in the side of a Co-op supermarket in Sapcote, Leicestershire, which took just 20 seconds. Similar to the robbery in York, the digger was left at the scene. Thieves also ploughed a stolen JCB digger in to a Marks & Spencer store before stealing the cash machine at Malvern Retail Park in Worcestershire. [1] (England) https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/jcb-thieves-ram-raid-barclays-olney-milton-keynes-a8468571.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/jcb-thieves-ram-raid-b... [2] (England) https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2921779/Now-s-hole-wall-Thieves-use-JCB-digger-rip-cash-machine-op-supermarket-overnight-raid.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2921779/Now-s-hole-... [3] (Ireland) https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2022/0304/1284407-atm/ https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2022/0304/1284407-atm/

eddieroger 4y ago

>For this reason I predict that, like domesticated dogs, robots have limited room to rove, close to protective masters. Maybe, but robots will have something that domesticated dogs, and their wild counterparts, don't have - the ability to communicate and effectively (perfectly?) share information. Just like a driver would ask a gas station attendant for directions, a lost robot could ask a local one for information on its surroundings and use that to plot a course. My Roomba may not need to leave my house, but it could tell a passing delivery bot when it has arrived at what I consider my front door.

goodpoint 4y ago

> They're packed with valuable electronics ... they can be captured Why people fuel this fantasy of roaming robots being stolen? Of all valuable things that can be stolen, old cars are the easiest choice for a thief and robots are the worst. An AI device filled to the brim with sensors, cameras, GPS and with remote connectivity is the perfect go-to-prison card. > Ultimately this leads to robots that can "defend themselves", and so to the obvious escalation of force between humans and machines. Is this scifi worldbuilding or reality? No, your new car is not going to incinerate thieves like in Robocop 2.

Rygian 4y ago
> An AI device filled to the brim with sensors, cameras, GPS and with remote connectivity Is therefore filled to the brim with valuables that an old car doesn't have. Take for example the ZiGGY [1]. I predict that within 24 hours of it being in service, someone will lift one of them into a van, drive away with it to an abandoned shed, and tear it down for the batteries inside, before the owner can do anything about it. [1] https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20220614005357/en/EV-Safe-Charge-Previews-ZiGGY%E2%84%A2-First-and-Only-Mobile-EV-Charging-Robot-with-Interactive-Advertising-Platform https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20220614005357/en/EV-...
- goodpoint 4y ago
  >> An AI device filled to the brim with sensors, cameras, GPS and with remote connectivity >Is therefore filled to the brim with valuables that an old car doesn't have. Because cameras and GPSes are expensive now? Is a phone more expensive than car from 20 years ago then?