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Just a minor myth busting here. Vincent Van Gogh was absolutely well known and well liked as a painter while he was alive. He didn’t make a lot of money at it,

Just a minor myth busting here. Vincent Van Gogh was absolutely well known and well liked as a painter while he was alive. He didn’t make a lot of money at it, and rich people didn’t fawn over his paintings, and he definitely suffered from mental illness before he committed suicide, but the myth that he was a failure as an artist during his life while he was alive is just that… a myth. The guy is the GOAT and while he was alive… many… many… other artists also saw him that way. His contemporaries absolutely adored him, and even tried to emulate him. His work was known to be important during his life to even the most financially successful of painters. I suppose if you limit the concept of “success” to how much money one earns in their life, then fine Van Gogh was not very financially successful, but he was monumentally successful and recognized as such during his life by the only real measure that matters: Impact. This is why as a journalist or a writer, it is important to confirm “what you know” before committing it to a piece. If you don’t verify everything you risk perpetuating myths instead of realities.

happytoexplain 4y ago
Isn't the trivia that he only sold one painting during his life (where I assume the definition of "sell" includes paid commissions), and it was to his brother? Are you saying that is true, but he was popular as an artist (just not successful financially as an artist)? Or is that bit of trivia also untrue? Edit: It occurs to me that also implicit in this popular definition of "successful artist" is that the majority of other well known artists were financially successful via their art, but I don't know if that's even true! Edit: The parent was edited after I made this comment to be more explicit about financial success vs reputational success.
- Finnucane 4y ago
  History is full of artists (whether painters, musicians, writers, etc.) who were known and respected by their peers, but failed to get much traction with the general public, and particularly with people who would pay money for their work, during their lifetime.
  - failTide 4y ago
    Are there some good examples of living artists/creatives who fit this description? I'd love to take a look.
    - bag_boy 4y ago
      Willis Alan Ramsey is an example of a musician who is really admired by musicians but not very well known.
      - failTide 4y ago
        Just listened to some of his work on youtube - awesome! thanks for sharing.
        bag_boy 4y ago
        Sure thing!
      - ambrose2 4y ago
        I came across a video of him on a YouTube journey one time, and really respected his performance, but I completely forgot his name and never came across him again until now, to your point.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
- coldcode 4y ago
  He might not have sold many paintings, but after he died by suicide Monet saw Irises (I think) and remarked something like "How can someone who paints with such joy be so sad". Selling art requires the right contacts, even today, and Vincent was unable to attract the right connections. If he had not shot himself, I think within a few years he would have been as famous as Monet.
  - nemo44x 4y ago
    His brother was a successful art dealer and helped Vincent out and believed in him, but wasn't able to get much traction with his work. He was pretty well connected in this way. However, he wasn't liked (Vincent) by many people and struggled to build valuable connections with other artists, etc. due to his awful personality, which was in large part due to his mental illness I'd assume. His brothers wife (his brother died from syphilis shortly after him) ended up with all his work and believed in it too. She was able to impress other with it and held a large show featuring his work a few years after his death and this is how he came into prominence.
  - technothrasher 4y ago
    > Selling art requires the right contacts, even today I was talking to a friend of mine who is a reasonably famous and financially successful modern impressionist painter about the market selling his oil paintings. It’s more than just the right contacts, the entire thing sounds more awful than used car sales, honestly. Lots of game playing, politics, back stabbing, and scamming. Just asking him what I figured would be a straightforward question of what kind of percentage commission galleries charge led to about on hour long conversation that I could barely follow. The short version seemed to be that if you’re naive or trusting, you’re screwed.
jb1991 4y ago
This comment is not quite accurate. He was known by some collectors but did not make any money from his art and generally considered a failure.
- adastra22 4y ago
  Also although he had many friends in the art space, he had trouble getting along with most of them. He wanted to make an artist colony in southern France, but for the most part it just ended up being him and his one friend, and that one friend eventually left. It’s that kind of failure that brought loneliness and his feeling of isolation.
  - mkolodny 4y ago
    That one friend was Paul Gauguin - a famous painter who Van Gogh looked up to. The two artists lived and painted together in Arles for two months. They had “excessively electric” debates about art that they emerged from exhausted. When Van Gogh could sense that Gauguin was going to leave, they had a heated argument. That night Van Gogh had a psychotic episode and cut off his own ear with a razor blade. Gauguin left right afterwards.
- jb1991 4y ago
  Too late to edit, but to add: the parent edited the comment after I posted mine.
jb1991 4y ago
> he was monumentally successful and recognized as such during his life by the only real measure that matters: Impact. He was nearly completely unknown in his own country until after his death.
ForeverAngle 4y ago
prvc 4y ago
This is further from the truth than the putative "myth" that you are attacking. He did gain some recognition from colleagues in the last 6 months of his life following a review by Albert Aurier at the beginning of 1890, but before that, he was very much cast out from the society of fellow artists in many contexts-- he was mocked for being odd by his classmates in Paris, even Gaugin needed essentially to be bribed to stay at the Yellow House (with his brother footing the bill, as always).
- jb1991 4y ago
  The irony is that the parent is stating a lot of inaccuracies or straight-up falsehoods, while ending with: > This is why as a journalist or a writer, it is important to confirm “what you know” before committing it to a piece. If you don’t verify everything you risk perpetuating myths instead of realities. I hazard to suggest the parent has not so much as read a biography of Van Gogh before posting such authoritative-sounding misinformation that is then silently edited to align with comments.

happytoexplain 4y ago

Isn't the trivia that he only sold one painting during his life (where I assume the definition of "sell" includes paid commissions), and it was to his brother? Are you saying that is true, but he was popular as an artist (just not successful financially as an artist)? Or is that bit of trivia also untrue? Edit: It occurs to me that also implicit in this popular definition of "successful artist" is that the majority of other well known artists were financially successful via their art, but I don't know if that's even true! Edit: The parent was edited after I made this comment to be more explicit about financial success vs reputational success.

Finnucane 4y ago
History is full of artists (whether painters, musicians, writers, etc.) who were known and respected by their peers, but failed to get much traction with the general public, and particularly with people who would pay money for their work, during their lifetime.
- failTide 4y ago
  Are there some good examples of living artists/creatives who fit this description? I'd love to take a look.
  - bag_boy 4y ago
    Willis Alan Ramsey is an example of a musician who is really admired by musicians but not very well known.
    - failTide 4y ago
      Just listened to some of his work on youtube - awesome! thanks for sharing.
      - bag_boy 4y ago
        Sure thing!
    - ambrose2 4y ago
      I came across a video of him on a YouTube journey one time, and really respected his performance, but I completely forgot his name and never came across him again until now, to your point.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
coldcode 4y ago
He might not have sold many paintings, but after he died by suicide Monet saw Irises (I think) and remarked something like "How can someone who paints with such joy be so sad". Selling art requires the right contacts, even today, and Vincent was unable to attract the right connections. If he had not shot himself, I think within a few years he would have been as famous as Monet.
- nemo44x 4y ago
  His brother was a successful art dealer and helped Vincent out and believed in him, but wasn't able to get much traction with his work. He was pretty well connected in this way. However, he wasn't liked (Vincent) by many people and struggled to build valuable connections with other artists, etc. due to his awful personality, which was in large part due to his mental illness I'd assume. His brothers wife (his brother died from syphilis shortly after him) ended up with all his work and believed in it too. She was able to impress other with it and held a large show featuring his work a few years after his death and this is how he came into prominence.
- technothrasher 4y ago
  > Selling art requires the right contacts, even today I was talking to a friend of mine who is a reasonably famous and financially successful modern impressionist painter about the market selling his oil paintings. It’s more than just the right contacts, the entire thing sounds more awful than used car sales, honestly. Lots of game playing, politics, back stabbing, and scamming. Just asking him what I figured would be a straightforward question of what kind of percentage commission galleries charge led to about on hour long conversation that I could barely follow. The short version seemed to be that if you’re naive or trusting, you’re screwed.

jb1991 4y ago

This comment is not quite accurate. He was known by some collectors but did not make any money from his art and generally considered a failure.

adastra22 4y ago
Also although he had many friends in the art space, he had trouble getting along with most of them. He wanted to make an artist colony in southern France, but for the most part it just ended up being him and his one friend, and that one friend eventually left. It’s that kind of failure that brought loneliness and his feeling of isolation.
- mkolodny 4y ago
  That one friend was Paul Gauguin - a famous painter who Van Gogh looked up to. The two artists lived and painted together in Arles for two months. They had “excessively electric” debates about art that they emerged from exhausted. When Van Gogh could sense that Gauguin was going to leave, they had a heated argument. That night Van Gogh had a psychotic episode and cut off his own ear with a razor blade. Gauguin left right afterwards.
jb1991 4y ago
Too late to edit, but to add: the parent edited the comment after I posted mine.

jb1991 4y ago

> he was monumentally successful and recognized as such during his life by the only real measure that matters: Impact. He was nearly completely unknown in his own country until after his death.

ForeverAngle 4y ago

prvc 4y ago

This is further from the truth than the putative "myth" that you are attacking. He did gain some recognition from colleagues in the last 6 months of his life following a review by Albert Aurier at the beginning of 1890, but before that, he was very much cast out from the society of fellow artists in many contexts-- he was mocked for being odd by his classmates in Paris, even Gaugin needed essentially to be bribed to stay at the Yellow House (with his brother footing the bill, as always).

jb1991 4y ago
The irony is that the parent is stating a lot of inaccuracies or straight-up falsehoods, while ending with: > This is why as a journalist or a writer, it is important to confirm “what you know” before committing it to a piece. If you don’t verify everything you risk perpetuating myths instead of realities. I hazard to suggest the parent has not so much as read a biography of Van Gogh before posting such authoritative-sounding misinformation that is then silently edited to align with comments.