7 ms·

Olkiluoto EPR reactor in Finland was connected to the grid in March this year. There are 2 more EPRs in construction, in France and UK. So yes, there were new

by vondro 4y ago

Olkiluoto EPR reactor in Finland was connected to the grid in March this year. There are 2 more EPRs in construction, in France and UK. So yes, there were new power plants coming online, but after budget overruns and missed timelines. Anyway, nuclear is still great baseline source of energy, so pity we don't build it better.

dividedbyzero 4y ago
Olkiluoto isn't fully online yet, that's expected to happen in December after it didn't pass trials and required repairs. It would then be 13 years late and cost about four times what was planned. The other two are looking like they're going in a similar direction.
- ttul 4y ago
  Thirteen years late and four times over budget for the first new plant in Finland in 42 years. I bet if they build a second one, it won’t take so long nor be so over-budget. In the UK, the Hinkley Point C project is over-budget and late, partly because they had problems with their initial concrete pours that necessitated exceptionally costly and time-consuming rebuilds. But as Hinkley gets closer to completion, the lessons learned are being transferred to Sizewell C, another EDF plant. [1] The world needs these large nuclear plants and we can’t just give up because the first few constructed went over budget and took too long. [1] https://www.economist.com/briefing/2022/06/23/energy-security-gives-climate-friendly-nuclear-power-plants-a-new-appeal https://www.economist.com/briefing/2022/06/23/energy-securit...
  - ncmncm 4y ago
    The lesson learned is there are sizeable overruns to be reaped on Sizewell, too, and not to be passed up. The world is notably worse for these projects diverting money away from renewables that would have already been displacing carbon emissions for a decade by now.
Schroedingersat 4y ago
> Anyway, nuclear is still great baseline source of energy, so pity we don't build it better. In what way? For the price that they actually cost after construction you can get double the capacity in wind, and double the capacity in solar, and a CAES plant capable of storing several days of energy at the same capacity, and the same capacity in a combined cycle gas plant, and a redox flow battery with 12 hours of storage, and a hydrogen electrolyser capable of producing enough hydrogen or methane to run the gas plant with change left over. All so you can make your energy infrastructure beholden to one fuel supplier where your country is not allowed to produce any yourself. Then you have to find somewhere to put the waste for millenia. And that only if you're on the short list of countries that the US, China, or France will even sell fuel to.
- ztratar 4y ago
  Can you show any sources for "same price = double the capacity in <renewable> + CAES storage"? That's a lofty claim and I have heard CAES storage at economic scales is still unsolved, else we'd see a rocketship company in the space. If you do know of a stealthy rocketship here, who is it?
  - usrusr 4y ago
    The reason you don't see "rocketship" investment is because the problem isn't hard enough, no matter how well you solve it you wouldn't be anywhere close to virtual monopoly. But despite that, hydrostor.ca got an investment of a quarter billion earlier this year, and they already started projects for A-CAES facilities in the GWh range (comparable to smaller pumped hydro) when their funding was less than a tenth of that (I suppose actual projects wouldn't be included in that funding, I think they see themselves as a project specialist, not as an owner/operator even if some/most/all current projects seem to be subsidiaries, perhaps a bit like spacex/starlink if you like space analogies).
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- weberer 4y ago
  You know Finland gets like 2 hours of sunlight in the winter. Its not a particularly windy place either.
percevalve 4y ago
For the EPR, you also had the Chinese Units, Taishan, that were started after but got connected to the grid before. https://pris.iaea.org/pris/CountryStatistics/ReactorDetails.aspx?current=918 https://pris.iaea.org/pris/CountryStatistics/ReactorDetails.... Other significant projects to check is the building by KEPCO and ENEC, I think BARAKAH-1 was the first unit connected: https://pris.iaea.org/PRIS/CountryStatistics/ReactorDetails.aspx?current=1050 https://pris.iaea.org/PRIS/CountryStatistics/ReactorDetails.... There are a lot of teams working on this issue, like Oklo: https://oklo.com https://oklo.com
- wnkrshm 4y ago
  There are some wonderful stories with the EPR, like falsification of material analysis records [0]. [0] https://www.french-nuclear-safety.fr/asn-informs/news-releases/falsification-of-materials-analysis-reports-asn-is-collaborating-with-the-ongoing-judicial-inquiry https://www.french-nuclear-safety.fr/asn-informs/news-releas...
  - percevalve 4y ago
    This is for a completely different reactor, "Equipment intended for the Jules Horowitz research reactor" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jules_Horowitz_Reactor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jules_Horowitz_Reactor
thepangolino 4y ago

by vondro 4y ago

dividedbyzero 4y ago

Olkiluoto isn't fully online yet, that's expected to happen in December after it didn't pass trials and required repairs. It would then be 13 years late and cost about four times what was planned. The other two are looking like they're going in a similar direction.

ttul 4y ago
Thirteen years late and four times over budget for the first new plant in Finland in 42 years. I bet if they build a second one, it won’t take so long nor be so over-budget. In the UK, the Hinkley Point C project is over-budget and late, partly because they had problems with their initial concrete pours that necessitated exceptionally costly and time-consuming rebuilds. But as Hinkley gets closer to completion, the lessons learned are being transferred to Sizewell C, another EDF plant. [1] The world needs these large nuclear plants and we can’t just give up because the first few constructed went over budget and took too long. [1] https://www.economist.com/briefing/2022/06/23/energy-security-gives-climate-friendly-nuclear-power-plants-a-new-appeal https://www.economist.com/briefing/2022/06/23/energy-securit...
- ncmncm 4y ago
  The lesson learned is there are sizeable overruns to be reaped on Sizewell, too, and not to be passed up. The world is notably worse for these projects diverting money away from renewables that would have already been displacing carbon emissions for a decade by now.

Schroedingersat 4y ago

> Anyway, nuclear is still great baseline source of energy, so pity we don't build it better. In what way? For the price that they actually cost after construction you can get double the capacity in wind, and double the capacity in solar, and a CAES plant capable of storing several days of energy at the same capacity, and the same capacity in a combined cycle gas plant, and a redox flow battery with 12 hours of storage, and a hydrogen electrolyser capable of producing enough hydrogen or methane to run the gas plant with change left over. All so you can make your energy infrastructure beholden to one fuel supplier where your country is not allowed to produce any yourself. Then you have to find somewhere to put the waste for millenia. And that only if you're on the short list of countries that the US, China, or France will even sell fuel to.

ztratar 4y ago
Can you show any sources for "same price = double the capacity in <renewable> + CAES storage"? That's a lofty claim and I have heard CAES storage at economic scales is still unsolved, else we'd see a rocketship company in the space. If you do know of a stealthy rocketship here, who is it?
- usrusr 4y ago
  The reason you don't see "rocketship" investment is because the problem isn't hard enough, no matter how well you solve it you wouldn't be anywhere close to virtual monopoly. But despite that, hydrostor.ca got an investment of a quarter billion earlier this year, and they already started projects for A-CAES facilities in the GWh range (comparable to smaller pumped hydro) when their funding was less than a tenth of that (I suppose actual projects wouldn't be included in that funding, I think they see themselves as a project specialist, not as an owner/operator even if some/most/all current projects seem to be subsidiaries, perhaps a bit like spacex/starlink if you like space analogies).
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
weberer 4y ago
You know Finland gets like 2 hours of sunlight in the winter. Its not a particularly windy place either.

percevalve 4y ago

For the EPR, you also had the Chinese Units, Taishan, that were started after but got connected to the grid before. https://pris.iaea.org/pris/CountryStatistics/ReactorDetails.aspx?current=918 https://pris.iaea.org/pris/CountryStatistics/ReactorDetails.... Other significant projects to check is the building by KEPCO and ENEC, I think BARAKAH-1 was the first unit connected: https://pris.iaea.org/PRIS/CountryStatistics/ReactorDetails.aspx?current=1050 https://pris.iaea.org/PRIS/CountryStatistics/ReactorDetails.... There are a lot of teams working on this issue, like Oklo: https://oklo.com https://oklo.com

wnkrshm 4y ago
There are some wonderful stories with the EPR, like falsification of material analysis records [0]. [0] https://www.french-nuclear-safety.fr/asn-informs/news-releases/falsification-of-materials-analysis-reports-asn-is-collaborating-with-the-ongoing-judicial-inquiry https://www.french-nuclear-safety.fr/asn-informs/news-releas...
- percevalve 4y ago
  This is for a completely different reactor, "Equipment intended for the Jules Horowitz research reactor" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jules_Horowitz_Reactor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jules_Horowitz_Reactor

thepangolino 4y ago