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This is spot on. More and more people are beginning to understand that we are witnessing is not a political ideology but a religion. As such it will go through

This is spot on. More and more people are beginning to understand that we are witnessing is not a political ideology but a religion. As such it will go through a similar cycle like Puritanism, Evangelical Christianity, etc.

pjbeam 4y ago
I think the distinction is a bit more blurry than you're implying here. Political (maybe too limiting) ideology is a linear model fit over the vast complexity of life that provides a framework for its adherents to make simple choices in the face of complex problems. Traditionally conceived "spiritual" religions seem very similar to me.
metadat 4y ago
Sort of, although presently the motivations of the left stem from efforts to protect vulnerable and traditionally disadvantaged groups of human beings. Meanwhile the conservative right seems to be going the traditional religion route. Along with a desire to be free to hate disadvantaged and vulnerable groups, and anyone arbitrarily deemed different? This is what it looks like from where I sit, anyhow.
- UIUC_06 4y ago
  So now instead of analyzing and understanding the culture war, you're taking a side in it.
  - metadat 4y ago
    I don't know how to get around the fact that it hurts me to see marginalized groups get trodden on and become further outcast by society. Marginalization amplifies the global amount of human pain and suffering, and for what purpose?
    - pdonis 4y ago
      You might want to consider the fact that the places where these people are the worst off--where they are most likely to be the victims of not just "marginalization" but outright violent crime--are places in which leftists control the government and have for a long time. This can be seen at the level of countries--would you rather be "marginalized" in the US, or killed or sent to a concentration camp for a lifetime of hard labor in Russia or China?--and at the level of different cities/jurisdictions within a country--the worst cities for minorities in the US in terms of actual objective facts like rates of violent crime are the strongholds of the left: New York, Chicago, Los Angeles. Why is this? I would say it's because cynical, corrupt politicians on the left are misusing your very human and worthwhile desire to help people who are less fortunate than you, in much the same way that cynical, corrupt politicians on the right are misusing other people's very human and natural desire to not have their lives micromanaged to the nth degree.
      - metadat 4y ago
        This seems like a logical error- the argument blames the government for crime against minorities in progressive regions. There aren't always viable structural solutions to these problems. Furthermore, it is defeatest and nhilistic to then conclude that we're all just pawns and screwed no matter what. I do like your analysis on the root causes - protecting people vs. life micromanagement, it succinctly sums up the fundamental difference in ideology.
- sn0w_crash 4y ago
  The thing is we know what this looks like from the right. We’ve seen it many times before and we know how to ridicule it in the public square. The emergence of a non-secular religious order from the left is a relatively new thing in America. Whereas on the ultra right you see hatred for people who look different, on the ultra left you see the same hatred for people who THINK different. Look at what happens when one of their own happens to disagree with them. They are immediately branded “X-ist” and casted out. An example is lifelong feminists who are being branded TERFs for the sin of questioning what’s happening in womens sports. I know plenty of Democrats who are not woke. I know plenty of republicans who are not religious zealots. It is important to note the distinction between these groups. PG’s essay is about the emergence of a new such group in the US which is both fascinating and dark.

pjbeam 4y ago

I think the distinction is a bit more blurry than you're implying here. Political (maybe too limiting) ideology is a linear model fit over the vast complexity of life that provides a framework for its adherents to make simple choices in the face of complex problems. Traditionally conceived "spiritual" religions seem very similar to me.

metadat 4y ago

Sort of, although presently the motivations of the left stem from efforts to protect vulnerable and traditionally disadvantaged groups of human beings. Meanwhile the conservative right seems to be going the traditional religion route. Along with a desire to be free to hate disadvantaged and vulnerable groups, and anyone arbitrarily deemed different? This is what it looks like from where I sit, anyhow.

UIUC_06 4y ago
So now instead of analyzing and understanding the culture war, you're taking a side in it.
- metadat 4y ago
  I don't know how to get around the fact that it hurts me to see marginalized groups get trodden on and become further outcast by society. Marginalization amplifies the global amount of human pain and suffering, and for what purpose?
  - pdonis 4y ago
    You might want to consider the fact that the places where these people are the worst off--where they are most likely to be the victims of not just "marginalization" but outright violent crime--are places in which leftists control the government and have for a long time. This can be seen at the level of countries--would you rather be "marginalized" in the US, or killed or sent to a concentration camp for a lifetime of hard labor in Russia or China?--and at the level of different cities/jurisdictions within a country--the worst cities for minorities in the US in terms of actual objective facts like rates of violent crime are the strongholds of the left: New York, Chicago, Los Angeles. Why is this? I would say it's because cynical, corrupt politicians on the left are misusing your very human and worthwhile desire to help people who are less fortunate than you, in much the same way that cynical, corrupt politicians on the right are misusing other people's very human and natural desire to not have their lives micromanaged to the nth degree.
    - metadat 4y ago
      This seems like a logical error- the argument blames the government for crime against minorities in progressive regions. There aren't always viable structural solutions to these problems. Furthermore, it is defeatest and nhilistic to then conclude that we're all just pawns and screwed no matter what. I do like your analysis on the root causes - protecting people vs. life micromanagement, it succinctly sums up the fundamental difference in ideology.
sn0w_crash 4y ago
The thing is we know what this looks like from the right. We’ve seen it many times before and we know how to ridicule it in the public square. The emergence of a non-secular religious order from the left is a relatively new thing in America. Whereas on the ultra right you see hatred for people who look different, on the ultra left you see the same hatred for people who THINK different. Look at what happens when one of their own happens to disagree with them. They are immediately branded “X-ist” and casted out. An example is lifelong feminists who are being branded TERFs for the sin of questioning what’s happening in womens sports. I know plenty of Democrats who are not woke. I know plenty of republicans who are not religious zealots. It is important to note the distinction between these groups. PG’s essay is about the emergence of a new such group in the US which is both fascinating and dark.