4 ms·

If I'm understanding correctly, it's worth zero iff you attribute $0 of value to the delivery. DD's value prop is that they deliver. If you don't want that, th

by lkbm 4y ago

If I'm understanding correctly, it's worth zero iff you attribute $0 of value to the delivery. DD's value prop is that they deliver. If you don't want that, then yes it's probably not for you.

BoorishBears 4y ago
With Doordash and co the fees over the normal cost of food are so high that even vs traditional delivery fees you're overpaying. - Off the top of my head, yesterday I passed a billboard for McDonalds advertising two large sandwiches for $6. Lets open Uber Eats and try ordering two Big Macs... $13.68 So they don't carry the deals. Not looking good already. Went to checkout... $1.49 delivery fee for a place 6 minutes away. Fair enough. $3.27 service fee. The explanation text is implying the cost of servicing my order (orchestration essentially) is more than double the cost of delivery. $2.00 CA Driver Benefits fee. Delivery drivers were always employees of independent stores, but Uber took such offense to being forced to provide healthcare that they itemize the cost. Grand total comes out to $20 before tax. For a $6 meal in store. - And in case you were thinking "Well Uber isn't DoorDash" this whole time... DoorDash comes out to $22 before tax. Has a "traditional" delivery place ever charged you a 60% delivery fee? It's so absurd I even tried increasing the order size... the ratio of price of fees to price of food actually went up! And all this is before tips!
- Fnoord 4y ago
  Well, you live in a country with tipping culture, but you're free to not tip. If its mandatory, then include it with the price. Its very American to pull this kind of BS. They mention a price, and then say X is tax, Y is delivery, but then they come with all kind of 'additions' (Apple does it here too, about mentioning environmental taxes or something). I don't give a shit about any of these (they're your expenses), just tell me what it costs and I'll say 'yes' or 'no'. I mean, what on Earth why would you as customer be responsible for 'CA Driver Benefits fee'? That's on the employer. And 'service fee'? Which service? The service you get is a proper delivery.
  - BoorishBears 4y ago
    Like I said, none of this includes tips, but decided to see if this happens in other countries, so I switched around my delivery location: UK: 10% "Service Charge" on top of delivery fees Spain: "Marketplace Fee" Canada (Montreàl): "Taxes and other fees" which when expanded shows "Service Fee" separate from. Doesn't seem to be tied at all to tipping culture, these companies are quite content taking extra money regardless of social norms
    - Fnoord 4y ago
      In my country the market leader is TakeAway / Just Eat (Thuisbezorgd) and they just mention a price for the food and a price for the delivery. Nothing else, no bullshit. If you're a regular customer, you're better off ordering directly though, since they take a cut of about 10%. Websites of restaurants regularly mention this, and since Dutch like to be cheap I suppose it works. In a way its honest to mention the 'service fee', if they were also upfront that the cut is because they're a broker/middleman.
      - BoorishBears 4y ago
        The problem is really that in total Uber Eats was asking for 300% what they claim delivery costs in exchange for what they provide as a broker. That's pretty absurd. - And I was skeptical seeing "no bullshit" in the same sentence as a gig economy app so I had to search, and of course the first result for "Thuisbezorgd service fee" was that they're hiding service costs by charging more than menu price... then turning around and claiming that's because it's the delivery menu. Which of course would mislead any reasonable person expecting to pay what the menu says... the one they'd hand you if you sat down. https://nltimes.nl/2022/05/29/meal-deliverers-misleading-clients-hidden-service-costs-unrealistic-offer https://nltimes.nl/2022/05/29/meal-deliverers-misleading-cli... - There's no way to make the current delivery app model work. The app needs to be small in scope and/or localized otherwise it seems without exception, "growth at all costs" leads to heavily subsidizing food and labor, then increasing costs drastically and decreasing pay once you have people hooked on the system.
gnicholas 4y ago
I do attribute some value to the delivery. But this was a promo code plus free delivery. A future promo code that doesn't have free delivery would result in even higher fees. So if it's a code for less than $20 I'd expect that entire amount would be eaten up by fees and the increased cost of menu items. Delivery would be extra.

by lkbm 4y ago

If I'm understanding correctly, it's worth zero iff you attribute $0 of value to the delivery. DD's value prop is that they deliver. If you don't want that, then yes it's probably not for you.

BoorishBears 4y ago

With Doordash and co the fees over the normal cost of food are so high that even vs traditional delivery fees you're overpaying. - Off the top of my head, yesterday I passed a billboard for McDonalds advertising two large sandwiches for $6. Lets open Uber Eats and try ordering two Big Macs... $13.68 So they don't carry the deals. Not looking good already. Went to checkout... $1.49 delivery fee for a place 6 minutes away. Fair enough. $3.27 service fee. The explanation text is implying the cost of servicing my order (orchestration essentially) is more than double the cost of delivery. $2.00 CA Driver Benefits fee. Delivery drivers were always employees of independent stores, but Uber took such offense to being forced to provide healthcare that they itemize the cost. Grand total comes out to $20 before tax. For a $6 meal in store. - And in case you were thinking "Well Uber isn't DoorDash" this whole time... DoorDash comes out to $22 before tax. Has a "traditional" delivery place ever charged you a 60% delivery fee? It's so absurd I even tried increasing the order size... the ratio of price of fees to price of food actually went up! And all this is before tips!

Fnoord 4y ago
Well, you live in a country with tipping culture, but you're free to not tip. If its mandatory, then include it with the price. Its very American to pull this kind of BS. They mention a price, and then say X is tax, Y is delivery, but then they come with all kind of 'additions' (Apple does it here too, about mentioning environmental taxes or something). I don't give a shit about any of these (they're your expenses), just tell me what it costs and I'll say 'yes' or 'no'. I mean, what on Earth why would you as customer be responsible for 'CA Driver Benefits fee'? That's on the employer. And 'service fee'? Which service? The service you get is a proper delivery.
- BoorishBears 4y ago
  Like I said, none of this includes tips, but decided to see if this happens in other countries, so I switched around my delivery location: UK: 10% "Service Charge" on top of delivery fees Spain: "Marketplace Fee" Canada (Montreàl): "Taxes and other fees" which when expanded shows "Service Fee" separate from. Doesn't seem to be tied at all to tipping culture, these companies are quite content taking extra money regardless of social norms
  - Fnoord 4y ago
    In my country the market leader is TakeAway / Just Eat (Thuisbezorgd) and they just mention a price for the food and a price for the delivery. Nothing else, no bullshit. If you're a regular customer, you're better off ordering directly though, since they take a cut of about 10%. Websites of restaurants regularly mention this, and since Dutch like to be cheap I suppose it works. In a way its honest to mention the 'service fee', if they were also upfront that the cut is because they're a broker/middleman.
    - BoorishBears 4y ago
      The problem is really that in total Uber Eats was asking for 300% what they claim delivery costs in exchange for what they provide as a broker. That's pretty absurd. - And I was skeptical seeing "no bullshit" in the same sentence as a gig economy app so I had to search, and of course the first result for "Thuisbezorgd service fee" was that they're hiding service costs by charging more than menu price... then turning around and claiming that's because it's the delivery menu. Which of course would mislead any reasonable person expecting to pay what the menu says... the one they'd hand you if you sat down. https://nltimes.nl/2022/05/29/meal-deliverers-misleading-clients-hidden-service-costs-unrealistic-offer https://nltimes.nl/2022/05/29/meal-deliverers-misleading-cli... - There's no way to make the current delivery app model work. The app needs to be small in scope and/or localized otherwise it seems without exception, "growth at all costs" leads to heavily subsidizing food and labor, then increasing costs drastically and decreasing pay once you have people hooked on the system.

gnicholas 4y ago

I do attribute some value to the delivery. But this was a promo code plus free delivery. A future promo code that doesn't have free delivery would result in even higher fees. So if it's a code for less than $20 I'd expect that entire amount would be eaten up by fees and the increased cost of menu items. Delivery would be extra.