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Memory is so cheap nowadays. 64GB laptop memory on NewEgg are $149.99. Surely a very easy investment for anyone working in a company that uses Teams. Just refus

Memory is so cheap nowadays. 64GB laptop memory on NewEgg are $149.99. Surely a very easy investment for anyone working in a company that uses Teams. Just refuse to buy laptops with non-upgradable memory. Having 64GB will solve all performance problems with Teams and other Electron apps.

Nextgrid 4y ago
It's also a pile of shit CPU-wise when trying to actually do anything with it, so lots of memory alone wouldn't help.
- borissk 4y ago
  You may be right, but that's not my experience. Chrome is very fast on modern CPUs if it doesn't have to use a swap file.
int_19h 4y ago
For a couple years, until it becomes the new norm, and devs will assume that now they can ignore even more perf issues.
- borissk 4y ago
  So you think stuff like C, C++, Java, Python, etc. should not exist and all code should be written in assembler?
  - int_19h 4y ago
    Writing stuff in C or C++ doesn't give you substantial perf benefits over assembler in most cases, so they don't belong to this list. That aside, no, I don't think we shouldn't be using higher-level abstractions. The problem is that we're using them without any consideration of performance impact at all, and increasingly without consideration of the actual cost/benefit ratio from developer perspective. For that matter, at some point, if you keep piling abstractions on, the amount of leakage from them all the way to the top layer is a tax on the developer operating on that layer - and that tax can, at some point, exceed the purported benefits of the abstraction. Do we really need to package a browser with every app just to make it easy to do (horribly designed more often than not) cross-platform UI? Or is it just the most expedient hack to avoid having to solve that problem properly?
chinabot 4y ago
Give the developers Corei3/8GB Laptops, I'm sure the next version would improve dramatically
- borissk 4y ago
  You may be up to something. The best video player I've used was Crystal Player - the developer used an old Pentium machine.
  - astrange 4y ago
    “Video player” developers don’t do any of the actual hard work, they just use ffmpeg, so it doesn’t matter how virtuous they personally are.
    - borissk 4y ago
      Crystal Player did not use ffmpeg. It came with a few codecs bundled, but you'd typically install a codec pack like K-Lite. Anyway building a fast and functional UI is actual hard work, don't know why you'd think otherwise.
      - astrange 4y ago
        K-Lite is mainly LAVFilter which is ffmpeg.
gpderetta 4y ago
This must be sarcasm, right? 64 GB for a glorified IRC chat...
- simplyinfinity 4y ago
  I would like to see you present and video chat to 100+ people on irc.
  - gpderetta 4y ago
    Seems a job for libcaca. In any case at $JOB we do not use Team for videochat (we use the even worse Webex for that) so for us Team is indeed a glorified IRC.

Nextgrid 4y ago

It's also a pile of shit CPU-wise when trying to actually do anything with it, so lots of memory alone wouldn't help.

borissk 4y ago
You may be right, but that's not my experience. Chrome is very fast on modern CPUs if it doesn't have to use a swap file.

int_19h 4y ago

For a couple years, until it becomes the new norm, and devs will assume that now they can ignore even more perf issues.

borissk 4y ago
So you think stuff like C, C++, Java, Python, etc. should not exist and all code should be written in assembler?
- int_19h 4y ago
  Writing stuff in C or C++ doesn't give you substantial perf benefits over assembler in most cases, so they don't belong to this list. That aside, no, I don't think we shouldn't be using higher-level abstractions. The problem is that we're using them without any consideration of performance impact at all, and increasingly without consideration of the actual cost/benefit ratio from developer perspective. For that matter, at some point, if you keep piling abstractions on, the amount of leakage from them all the way to the top layer is a tax on the developer operating on that layer - and that tax can, at some point, exceed the purported benefits of the abstraction. Do we really need to package a browser with every app just to make it easy to do (horribly designed more often than not) cross-platform UI? Or is it just the most expedient hack to avoid having to solve that problem properly?

chinabot 4y ago

Give the developers Corei3/8GB Laptops, I'm sure the next version would improve dramatically

borissk 4y ago
You may be up to something. The best video player I've used was Crystal Player - the developer used an old Pentium machine.
- astrange 4y ago
  “Video player” developers don’t do any of the actual hard work, they just use ffmpeg, so it doesn’t matter how virtuous they personally are.
  - borissk 4y ago
    Crystal Player did not use ffmpeg. It came with a few codecs bundled, but you'd typically install a codec pack like K-Lite. Anyway building a fast and functional UI is actual hard work, don't know why you'd think otherwise.
    - astrange 4y ago
      K-Lite is mainly LAVFilter which is ffmpeg.

gpderetta 4y ago

This must be sarcasm, right? 64 GB for a glorified IRC chat...

simplyinfinity 4y ago
I would like to see you present and video chat to 100+ people on irc.
- gpderetta 4y ago
  Seems a job for libcaca. In any case at $JOB we do not use Team for videochat (we use the even worse Webex for that) so for us Team is indeed a glorified IRC.