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> Vite is powering a renewed innovation race in Web frameworks. Wait what, again? I thought we all silently agreed to use the mature/legacy frameworks React an

by 202206241203 4y ago

> Vite is powering a renewed innovation race in Web frameworks. Wait what, again? I thought we all silently agreed to use the mature/legacy frameworks React and Angular until the proper WASM arrives so that we could burn all of JS/CSS/HTML...

ramesh31 4y ago
>I thought we all silently agreed to use the mature/legacy frameworks React and Angular until the proper WASM arrives so that we could burn all of JS/CSS/HTML... We did. But people without real problems to solve will continue reinventing the wheel, while we silently churn away on actual products with stable tooling.
- SahAssar 4y ago
  As someone who has worked in a lot of frontend (Vue, react, various microframeworks) I would heavily disagree that the tooling is "stable". It's incredibly fickle and breaks in ways that are hard to debug. Microframeworks are slightly better, especially if they support no-build setups since then a "build step" for prod is only bundling and minification.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- cercatrova 4y ago
  This comment and the parent's tells me that neither of you know what vite does or have used it before, if you're implying that it's not fixing "real problems." Webpack is slow due to being written in JS, so when a bundler comes along written in Go and makes builds 10x faster, that is solving a "real problem."
  - francisofascii 4y ago
    > Webpack is slow So it sounds like Webpack was never really mature, or too late in getting ported to Go before Vite took over?
    - cercatrova 4y ago
      The latter mainly. The biggest reason is that JS is too slow compared to other languages, especially compiled ones like Go or Rust. So writing developer tools in JS already made them slow.
  - ramesh31 4y ago
    >Webpack is slow due to being written in JS, so when a bundler comes along written in Go and makes builds 10x faster, that is solving a "real problem." I've worked on projects with hundreds of thousands of LOC compiling with Webpack. Build time has literally never been a concern for me. The entire point of tooling like Webpack is that it's written in JS because dealing with interop between native binaries is an absolute nightmare. It's a feature, not a bug. The same reason we moved to JS based SASS/PostCSS compilers.
ForSpareParts 4y ago
The description is maybe a little misleading. Vite is a development experience improvement for existing frontend frameworks; most people using it are on React or Vue (which is the other of the "big 3" along with React and Angular). It's about making projects build and start faster.
- francisofascii 4y ago
  For clarification, isn't it true that you can only use Vite with Vue and React, and not Angular. Angular is too tied to WebPack (At least not today) I am not entirely sure, so I wanted to ask.
  - rk06 4y ago
    Vite is framework agnostic. But angular being too big and too monolith requires large change to move from webpack to vite. Some folks have attempted it, but not completed vite support. This is nothing new in angular land. There are multiple third party libraries and framework which support react, vue, svelte and even solid, but not angular.

ramesh31 4y ago

>I thought we all silently agreed to use the mature/legacy frameworks React and Angular until the proper WASM arrives so that we could burn all of JS/CSS/HTML... We did. But people without real problems to solve will continue reinventing the wheel, while we silently churn away on actual products with stable tooling.

SahAssar 4y ago
As someone who has worked in a lot of frontend (Vue, react, various microframeworks) I would heavily disagree that the tooling is "stable". It's incredibly fickle and breaks in ways that are hard to debug. Microframeworks are slightly better, especially if they support no-build setups since then a "build step" for prod is only bundling and minification.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
cercatrova 4y ago
This comment and the parent's tells me that neither of you know what vite does or have used it before, if you're implying that it's not fixing "real problems." Webpack is slow due to being written in JS, so when a bundler comes along written in Go and makes builds 10x faster, that is solving a "real problem."
- francisofascii 4y ago
  > Webpack is slow So it sounds like Webpack was never really mature, or too late in getting ported to Go before Vite took over?
  - cercatrova 4y ago
    The latter mainly. The biggest reason is that JS is too slow compared to other languages, especially compiled ones like Go or Rust. So writing developer tools in JS already made them slow.
- ramesh31 4y ago
  >Webpack is slow due to being written in JS, so when a bundler comes along written in Go and makes builds 10x faster, that is solving a "real problem." I've worked on projects with hundreds of thousands of LOC compiling with Webpack. Build time has literally never been a concern for me. The entire point of tooling like Webpack is that it's written in JS because dealing with interop between native binaries is an absolute nightmare. It's a feature, not a bug. The same reason we moved to JS based SASS/PostCSS compilers.

ForSpareParts 4y ago

The description is maybe a little misleading. Vite is a development experience improvement for existing frontend frameworks; most people using it are on React or Vue (which is the other of the "big 3" along with React and Angular). It's about making projects build and start faster.

francisofascii 4y ago
For clarification, isn't it true that you can only use Vite with Vue and React, and not Angular. Angular is too tied to WebPack (At least not today) I am not entirely sure, so I wanted to ask.
- rk06 4y ago
  Vite is framework agnostic. But angular being too big and too monolith requires large change to move from webpack to vite. Some folks have attempted it, but not completed vite support. This is nothing new in angular land. There are multiple third party libraries and framework which support react, vue, svelte and even solid, but not angular.