4 ms·

This isn't about enemies or anything else. It's about what used to be a technical news site using emotive language to describe people. News should be impartial,

This isn't about enemies or anything else. It's about what used to be a technical news site using emotive language to describe people. News should be impartial, but I see a significant amount of opinion-building. Musk has always been Steve Jobs -ish. He focused on rockets and electric cars instead of shiny things that go in your desk or pocket or wrist though, and against all odds succeeded where many others have failed. Yes he's an asshole, and I'd hate to work for him, but he's also pushed humanity forward by corralling a bunch of people to all pull in the same direction. My issue is more with Ars, where all the reporting used to be like the rocket section, but since the acquisition by Condé Nast the rest of it has turned into tech tabloid. I want newsworthy information, not what some guy did in his personal time.

maxbond 4y ago
This is goalpost moving. We weren't discussing the journalistic integrity of Ars Technia, we were discussing whether or not Musk's enemies are real or imagined. I didn't identify Ars as an enemy, I asked who these enemies were, and it was you who suggested it. He is not pushing humanity forward and certainly isn't getting people to pull in the same direction. If you disagree, I would be curious to hear how Neuralink and his Twitter acquisition are related, or how his frequent scandals help to keep people to focused on the mission. He has no real vision to be pushing humanity forward to, he has a series of smokescreens. It is plain for me to see that Musk has no strategy, and that these are a series of tactics to maintain relevance and distract from the issues he'd rather we forget about (such as the sexual harassment allegations that have recently been made public, or that FSD is not and has never been "one year away"). At best he's a distraction. But he's worse than that, he siphons energy and attention that should be directed towards actually addressing climate change and other existential challenges into a vortex that ultimately serves to empower him and feed his ego. His contribution to the success of SpaceX and Tesla is his prolific talent for charming people and attracting investment and attention. In many ways they succeed despite him, not because of him. In a world without Musk, people are still working on these problems and making the same breakthroughs, just under a different corporate entity. It is not the unique insight of Elon Musk which makes these innovations possible. It is decades of research, mostly funded by the taxpayer, mostly taking place at universities and national labs. The engineers at SpaceX and Tesla are taking it the "last mile" to commercialization. These are both critical contributions. But if Musk were not the one to hire these engineers, it would Bezos or Branson or somebody else - when the idea is ready to be commercialized, someone will be there to fund it. Being able to promote an idea and attract investment is a real and challenging skill, but it's not on the critical path to introducing these innovations to society. (It is absolutely on the critical path for creating and sustaining an individual company, however.)
- snovv_crash 4y ago
  You severely underestimate his impact on the success of both Tesla and SpaceX, it extends beyond just a 'getting funding and charming people' perspective. Ask Bezos about combustion instabilities in turbopumps and he isn't going to give you a 20 minute lecture on the pros and cons of gas bearings and alloy design. Toyota, the world's largest auto manufacturer, is still avoiding making an electric vehicle. Musk is eccentric, and doesn't have all of his communication go through a PR team. Show me anybody else at a similar publicity level who isn't behind 3 layers of PR firewalls. Of course there will be scandals. You just don't see all the detestable opinions the other rich and famous people have. In addition, he has a lot of powerful enemies. Big Oil, ULA etc have been hit hard by the work he's done to bring new tech to public consciousness. Who Killed The Electric Car etc. I'm surprised there haven't been many more of the unfalsifiable type of scandals or even court cases tying up his time. 3 years ago, everybody loved him. He was saving the planet with Tesla and bringing back American access to the ISS with SpaceX. Suddenly people care more about him not being married to the celebrity he is having children with, or that he isn't happy with a corporate deal, like somehow we're all major Twitter shareholders. It's ridiculous, and I'm pointing out how the media is shaping people's opinions on frankly irrelevant details in the greater scheme of things. I'm not a lawyer, and I haven't read the contract Musk made with Twitter. Unless you're somehow different on both of those counts, it may behoove you to consider where your strong opinions on this matter come from, and whether they are really yours.
  - maxbond 4y ago
    So Musk's enemies are Ars Technia. Then it wasn't about enemies. And now Musk's enemies are so plentiful and powerful, that I'm not even allowed an opinion, I'm just a dupe. Musk's reputation was killed by Musk, and it was because he showed the world who he was. I realized his words were nonsense and formed an opinion based on his actions. You should consider doing the same. As a final note, I think you should consider it a red flag in your own thinking when you can't even conceive that someone would disagree with you on this topic, and you need to invoke a conspiracy to explain my having a differing opinion. Regardless of how you feel about Musk, even if you're correct, that should jump out to you as a problem which deserves reflection.

maxbond 4y ago

This is goalpost moving. We weren't discussing the journalistic integrity of Ars Technia, we were discussing whether or not Musk's enemies are real or imagined. I didn't identify Ars as an enemy, I asked who these enemies were, and it was you who suggested it. He is not pushing humanity forward and certainly isn't getting people to pull in the same direction. If you disagree, I would be curious to hear how Neuralink and his Twitter acquisition are related, or how his frequent scandals help to keep people to focused on the mission. He has no real vision to be pushing humanity forward to, he has a series of smokescreens. It is plain for me to see that Musk has no strategy, and that these are a series of tactics to maintain relevance and distract from the issues he'd rather we forget about (such as the sexual harassment allegations that have recently been made public, or that FSD is not and has never been "one year away"). At best he's a distraction. But he's worse than that, he siphons energy and attention that should be directed towards actually addressing climate change and other existential challenges into a vortex that ultimately serves to empower him and feed his ego. His contribution to the success of SpaceX and Tesla is his prolific talent for charming people and attracting investment and attention. In many ways they succeed despite him, not because of him. In a world without Musk, people are still working on these problems and making the same breakthroughs, just under a different corporate entity. It is not the unique insight of Elon Musk which makes these innovations possible. It is decades of research, mostly funded by the taxpayer, mostly taking place at universities and national labs. The engineers at SpaceX and Tesla are taking it the "last mile" to commercialization. These are both critical contributions. But if Musk were not the one to hire these engineers, it would Bezos or Branson or somebody else - when the idea is ready to be commercialized, someone will be there to fund it. Being able to promote an idea and attract investment is a real and challenging skill, but it's not on the critical path to introducing these innovations to society. (It is absolutely on the critical path for creating and sustaining an individual company, however.)

snovv_crash 4y ago
You severely underestimate his impact on the success of both Tesla and SpaceX, it extends beyond just a 'getting funding and charming people' perspective. Ask Bezos about combustion instabilities in turbopumps and he isn't going to give you a 20 minute lecture on the pros and cons of gas bearings and alloy design. Toyota, the world's largest auto manufacturer, is still avoiding making an electric vehicle. Musk is eccentric, and doesn't have all of his communication go through a PR team. Show me anybody else at a similar publicity level who isn't behind 3 layers of PR firewalls. Of course there will be scandals. You just don't see all the detestable opinions the other rich and famous people have. In addition, he has a lot of powerful enemies. Big Oil, ULA etc have been hit hard by the work he's done to bring new tech to public consciousness. Who Killed The Electric Car etc. I'm surprised there haven't been many more of the unfalsifiable type of scandals or even court cases tying up his time. 3 years ago, everybody loved him. He was saving the planet with Tesla and bringing back American access to the ISS with SpaceX. Suddenly people care more about him not being married to the celebrity he is having children with, or that he isn't happy with a corporate deal, like somehow we're all major Twitter shareholders. It's ridiculous, and I'm pointing out how the media is shaping people's opinions on frankly irrelevant details in the greater scheme of things. I'm not a lawyer, and I haven't read the contract Musk made with Twitter. Unless you're somehow different on both of those counts, it may behoove you to consider where your strong opinions on this matter come from, and whether they are really yours.
- maxbond 4y ago
  So Musk's enemies are Ars Technia. Then it wasn't about enemies. And now Musk's enemies are so plentiful and powerful, that I'm not even allowed an opinion, I'm just a dupe. Musk's reputation was killed by Musk, and it was because he showed the world who he was. I realized his words were nonsense and formed an opinion based on his actions. You should consider doing the same. As a final note, I think you should consider it a red flag in your own thinking when you can't even conceive that someone would disagree with you on this topic, and you need to invoke a conspiracy to explain my having a differing opinion. Regardless of how you feel about Musk, even if you're correct, that should jump out to you as a problem which deserves reflection.