4 ms·

Is this kind of like sourdough? Since there's no starter culture, seems like it will ferment with whatever random yeast or bacteria happens to land in it while

by wffurr 4y ago

Is this kind of like sourdough? Since there's no starter culture, seems like it will ferment with whatever random yeast or bacteria happens to land in it while you're preparing it.

moring 4y ago
I tried making sourdough without a starter culture several times and it worked every time (1), so I suspect that having the correct conditions may be sufficient depending on what you want to ferment. (1) to be precise, it looked and tasted the same every time, and it was somewhat sour and not disgusting, so I just assumed that it worked ;)
- brigandish 4y ago
  Sourdough does use yeast from the air and feeds on the flour (often with help from a sugary friend like an apple), but fermentation of vegetables is usually from bacteria on the skin of the veg, for instance in sauerkraut the bacteria that kicks off fermentation is Leuconostoc mesenteroides which is found on the skin of cabbage (and many other veg). With both you can use a starter, often from the previous batch but buying them works too. My first attempts at sourdough weren't very successful at all and I wish I'd chosen a famous starter to get that good taste, even once I got it going okay it wasn't a great taste, the yeast strains in my kitchen can't have been that good! [1] https://olykraut.com/blogs/knowledge/the-stages-of-sauerkraut-fermentation/#main-content https://olykraut.com/blogs/knowledge/the-stages-of-sauerkrau... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leuconostoc_mesenteroides#Environment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leuconostoc_mesenteroides#Envi...
giraffe_lady 4y ago
Similar yeah. It'll be mostly lactobaccilus that's already present on the vegetables. Probably will pick up some other stuff from the environment and your skin but the dominant strains will be from the product itself. Similarly with sourdough, the main yeast and bacteria strains are already present in the flour when you start and grow from there. Some surely get introduced from the air as well but they aren't that significant compared to the ones that "come with."
colechristensen 4y ago
The salt and then the acid metabolites narrows the kinds of things which can grow considerably. Lacto-fermenting bacteria are everywhere

by wffurr 4y ago

Is this kind of like sourdough? Since there's no starter culture, seems like it will ferment with whatever random yeast or bacteria happens to land in it while you're preparing it.

moring 4y ago

I tried making sourdough without a starter culture several times and it worked every time (1), so I suspect that having the correct conditions may be sufficient depending on what you want to ferment. (1) to be precise, it looked and tasted the same every time, and it was somewhat sour and not disgusting, so I just assumed that it worked ;)

brigandish 4y ago
Sourdough does use yeast from the air and feeds on the flour (often with help from a sugary friend like an apple), but fermentation of vegetables is usually from bacteria on the skin of the veg, for instance in sauerkraut the bacteria that kicks off fermentation is Leuconostoc mesenteroides which is found on the skin of cabbage (and many other veg). With both you can use a starter, often from the previous batch but buying them works too. My first attempts at sourdough weren't very successful at all and I wish I'd chosen a famous starter to get that good taste, even once I got it going okay it wasn't a great taste, the yeast strains in my kitchen can't have been that good! [1] https://olykraut.com/blogs/knowledge/the-stages-of-sauerkraut-fermentation/#main-content https://olykraut.com/blogs/knowledge/the-stages-of-sauerkrau... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leuconostoc_mesenteroides#Environment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leuconostoc_mesenteroides#Envi...

giraffe_lady 4y ago

Similar yeah. It'll be mostly lactobaccilus that's already present on the vegetables. Probably will pick up some other stuff from the environment and your skin but the dominant strains will be from the product itself. Similarly with sourdough, the main yeast and bacteria strains are already present in the flour when you start and grow from there. Some surely get introduced from the air as well but they aren't that significant compared to the ones that "come with."

colechristensen 4y ago

The salt and then the acid metabolites narrows the kinds of things which can grow considerably. Lacto-fermenting bacteria are everywhere