4 ms·

Are you really of the view that there are no downsides to unionized labor?

by sn0w_crash 4y ago

feet 4y ago
[flagged]
- junofan 4y ago
  Nobody said anything about profits. If airbags are failing because of inadequate workmanship, people should know.
  - yellowapple 4y ago
    It's just as likely of a conclusion (as pointed out elsewhere) that people are informed because of unionization - i.e. that union workers are better empowered to point out design flaws or other recall-worthy issues (without fear of reprisal over having embarassed the management) than non-union workers. That is: using recalls to measure product quality is highly misleading for reasons that take all of five seconds to identify, and the fact that the paper chose such a metric despite such an obvious flaw reeks of bad faith.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- cercatrova 4y ago
  > Are you saying that we should prioritize product quality over the workers who make them? It depends on the product in question but of course the product should be prioritized, it is what is being produced and sold after all. Without the product, the workers would not be at that company.
  - feet 4y ago
    You must be in favor of abolishing police unions then, eh? The quality of the product is piss poor
    - cercatrova 4y ago
      Sure, I am definitely in favor.
- rockemsockem 4y ago
  You know there are other conclusions one could draw from that. If unions really do produce lower quality products then there's sort a of a nice cycle that happens (albeit likely over far too long a time period). A company mistreats its workers, the workers unionize, the company's product-quality reduces, the company becomes a better target for competitors. I'm all for making it easy for workers to unionize, but in a lot of cases I'll hope they don't. That kind of logic might not apply to scenarios where companies are too huge, but that seems to be a problem best solved with other tools.
pjmlp 4y ago
Everything has downsides as well. In the case of the unions, the plus side outweigh the downsides. It is a pity that one country that fought so hard to have them a century ago after its first capitalism collapse, nowadays has a society that pushes back to a feudal system (aka gig economy and perks instead of salary/decent work hours).

Are you really of the view that there are no downsides to unionized labor?

feet 4y ago

[flagged]

junofan 4y ago
Nobody said anything about profits. If airbags are failing because of inadequate workmanship, people should know.
- yellowapple 4y ago
  It's just as likely of a conclusion (as pointed out elsewhere) that people are informed because of unionization - i.e. that union workers are better empowered to point out design flaws or other recall-worthy issues (without fear of reprisal over having embarassed the management) than non-union workers. That is: using recalls to measure product quality is highly misleading for reasons that take all of five seconds to identify, and the fact that the paper chose such a metric despite such an obvious flaw reeks of bad faith.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
cercatrova 4y ago
> Are you saying that we should prioritize product quality over the workers who make them? It depends on the product in question but of course the product should be prioritized, it is what is being produced and sold after all. Without the product, the workers would not be at that company.
- feet 4y ago
  You must be in favor of abolishing police unions then, eh? The quality of the product is piss poor
  - cercatrova 4y ago
    Sure, I am definitely in favor.
rockemsockem 4y ago
You know there are other conclusions one could draw from that. If unions really do produce lower quality products then there's sort a of a nice cycle that happens (albeit likely over far too long a time period). A company mistreats its workers, the workers unionize, the company's product-quality reduces, the company becomes a better target for competitors. I'm all for making it easy for workers to unionize, but in a lot of cases I'll hope they don't. That kind of logic might not apply to scenarios where companies are too huge, but that seems to be a problem best solved with other tools.

pjmlp 4y ago

Everything has downsides as well. In the case of the unions, the plus side outweigh the downsides. It is a pity that one country that fought so hard to have them a century ago after its first capitalism collapse, nowadays has a society that pushes back to a feudal system (aka gig economy and perks instead of salary/decent work hours).