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> They all only work if there is a caloric deficit I don't believe this is true. On keto for example, I lost weight when eating an excess of calories. > Calor

> They all only work if there is a caloric deficit I don't believe this is true. On keto for example, I lost weight when eating an excess of calories. > Calories in - calories out ("CICO") is absolutely backed by science when the researchers are smart enough to actually account for known things like caloric cost of digestion (changes the "CO" part) Not exactly. If you eat fewer calories than you burn, you'll obviously lose weight. But the reverse is not necessarily true. For that to be the case, your body would have to always store all excess calories. This is probably pretty close to what happens on a high-carb diet, though, because insulin is a fat storage hormone.

maerF0x0 4y ago
> I lost weight when eating an excess of calories. You're just misunderstanding your TDEE then. It's basic thermodynamics that is very accurate in human digestion too, save for extremes like bulemia, gastric distress (you shit out undigested food), or pills that simulate it w/ carb/fat blockers. The most pedantic detail is CICO is actually on digested calories, not swallowed calories. Your anecdata is likely accounted by: 1. Protein takes more calories to digest (many people unintentionally eat more protein on keto, though keto is actually about fat intake and protein can break ketosis through gluconeogensis) 2. Up regulation in things like thermogenesis (ie you lose more calories to the ambient air) 3. Inaccuracy in food tracking 4. Higher NEAT 5. Loss of water weight due to lower food mass in digestive tract, and lower glycogen(+bound water) weight.
- wtetzner 4y ago
  > 1. Protein takes more calories to digest (many people unintentionally eat more protein on keto, though keto is actually about fat intake and protein can break ketosis through gluconeogensis) I'm pretty sure this is a myth, unless you're eating such a small amount of fat that you can't get energy anywhere but though gluconeogensis. Your body uses gluconeogensis to create glucose for the cells that need it. It's not an efficient way to produce energy for cells that can just use ketones. > Your anecdata is likely accounted by: I suspect it's mostly that I didn't store all of the excess calories I ate. E.g. I've seen excess fat in my stool. When people say CICO doesn't work, they don't mean thermodynamics doesn't work. They mean that not all calories consumed (i.e. eaten) get burned or stored. If you limit "Calories In" only the calories that get burned or stored, then sure, tautologically, CICO is correct.

maerF0x0 4y ago

> I lost weight when eating an excess of calories. You're just misunderstanding your TDEE then. It's basic thermodynamics that is very accurate in human digestion too, save for extremes like bulemia, gastric distress (you shit out undigested food), or pills that simulate it w/ carb/fat blockers. The most pedantic detail is CICO is actually on digested calories, not swallowed calories. Your anecdata is likely accounted by: 1. Protein takes more calories to digest (many people unintentionally eat more protein on keto, though keto is actually about fat intake and protein can break ketosis through gluconeogensis) 2. Up regulation in things like thermogenesis (ie you lose more calories to the ambient air) 3. Inaccuracy in food tracking 4. Higher NEAT 5. Loss of water weight due to lower food mass in digestive tract, and lower glycogen(+bound water) weight.

wtetzner 4y ago
> 1. Protein takes more calories to digest (many people unintentionally eat more protein on keto, though keto is actually about fat intake and protein can break ketosis through gluconeogensis) I'm pretty sure this is a myth, unless you're eating such a small amount of fat that you can't get energy anywhere but though gluconeogensis. Your body uses gluconeogensis to create glucose for the cells that need it. It's not an efficient way to produce energy for cells that can just use ketones. > Your anecdata is likely accounted by: I suspect it's mostly that I didn't store all of the excess calories I ate. E.g. I've seen excess fat in my stool. When people say CICO doesn't work, they don't mean thermodynamics doesn't work. They mean that not all calories consumed (i.e. eaten) get burned or stored. If you limit "Calories In" only the calories that get burned or stored, then sure, tautologically, CICO is correct.