5 ms·

Ross got a raw deal. I think 15yrs would have been reasonable

refurb 4y ago
He was bragging “they’ll never catch me” (Forbes interview). He made the US govt and DEA look like fools. So they made an example out of him. If he was smart he should kept a lower profile and his first interaction with police (the multiple fake IDs) he should have shut it all down or pass the site to someone else. But hey ego and hubris gets the best of us.
- ArrayBoundCheck 4y ago
  So because you pissed off someone in the government you get life in jail? That's not justice. That could be what happened but idk I hate the idea he's not getting released and IIRC he killed noone and robbed noone
  - natpalmer1776 4y ago
    The legal system is worth only as much as the population it governs believes in it's authority. Undermining the authority in a public manner is a sure fire way to ensure that the legal system will use you to reassert it's own authority as an act of long term preservation of the system's status quo.
    - throwaway654329 4y ago
      To call that a legal system and not a systemic political persecution is probably not uniquely American, though it is uniquely on display in this case. Lately with SCOTUS, I think we are seeing widespread dissent about the worth of the entire legal system. For many, the system was already unbelievably unjust simply for the logic of what you observe. That’s just how it is, but is that how it should be?
  - refurb 4y ago
    It has to do with restitution and admitting guilt. If you rob a bank, get caught, say sorry and work at restitution you’ll often be given a lighter sentence. Rob a bank then brag that the cops will never catch you and you’re glad you got away with it? Yeah, you’ll get a more severe sentence. The idea is that justice should take restitution and admission of guilt into account.
    - galaxyLogic 4y ago
      > The idea is that justice should take restitution and admission of guilt into account. Doesn't that imply that not admitting guilt is a crime for which you get an extra penalty? Let's assume that is correct and ethical. The question then is how big should such an extra penalty be, for the crime of not agreeing you are guilty? Life in prison? Or perhaps capital punishment? https://www.aclu.org/news/criminal-law-reform/coercive-plea-bargaining-has-poisoned-the-criminal-justice-system-its-time-to-suck-the-venom-out https://www.aclu.org/news/criminal-law-reform/coercive-plea-...
      - refurb 4y ago
        It’s not a crime it’s a consideration taken into account during sentencing.
  - pm90 4y ago
    > idk I hate the idea he's not getting released and IIRC he killed noone and robbed noone Then its good that we as a society have institutions that have a better judgement than you, random internet netizen. There’s a reason people wear suits to court and we have all sorts of processes designed to venerate authority. Before modern times, power flowed from the Monarch. Now, we choose our representatives but the instruments by which power is administered still exists.
  - etchalon 4y ago
    He didn't get life in prison because he pissed someone off in the government. He got life in prison because the laws he broke called for it.
greenthrow 4y ago
He tried to have people murdered. He ran an illicit marketplace for tons of illegal activity. He deserves life.
- throwaway654329 4y ago
  In a civilized country such as many developed countries in Europe a life sentence is roughly fifteen to twenty years. That is a remarkably long time. It is an extreme punishment. There are exceptions for psycho killers like Anders Breivik. Ulbrich would be unlikely to fall into the Breivik category. His prison conditions would not be so brutal either, see again Breivik for an example. If you believe he deserves life, do you believe he deserves brutality in prison? He is by many international legal definitions a political prisoner found guilty of what appear as obviously relative political crimes and likely even absolute political crimes. His politics were core to his supposed criminal activities in the war on some drugs. His investigation and prosecution was tainted. Several of the involved officers committed blatant crimes for personal gain for which they were later arrested, charged, and convicted. Those same state agents appear to have alleged the murder for hire, which is somehow not entrapment and yet considered credible. In 1769, William Blackstone said “the law holds that it is better that 10 guilty persons escape, than that 1 innocent suffer (innocent person be convicted).” Morally and in principle, especially in a tainted investigation with misbehaving Government agents, the guilty should be let go. Perhaps you don’t agree - either way, there is an appearance of a two tier legal system. The system that jails Ross but lets very wealthy pharmacy company owners off with thousands of confirmed deaths, people who produced, marketed, and sold similar and sometimes identical drugs exclusively for profit are punished with a fine.
  - Nursie 4y ago
    > He is by many international legal definitions a political prisoner No, this is bullshit. He committed several serious crimes and is now paying the price for that. Yes, reform the legal system sensibly. No, we don't let drug kingpins who have built up a serious crime organisation walk.
    - 4y ago
hluska 4y ago
Ross Ulbricht was offered a plea deal before his indictment. The plea called for a minimum sentence of ten years up to a maximum of one life term. He should have taken the plea.

He was bragging “they’ll never catch me” (Forbes interview). He made the US govt and DEA look like fools. So they made an example out of him. If he was smart he should kept a lower profile and his first interaction with police (the multiple fake IDs) he should have shut it all down or pass the site to someone else. But hey ego and hubris gets the best of us.

ArrayBoundCheck 4y ago
So because you pissed off someone in the government you get life in jail? That's not justice. That could be what happened but idk I hate the idea he's not getting released and IIRC he killed noone and robbed noone
- natpalmer1776 4y ago
  The legal system is worth only as much as the population it governs believes in it's authority. Undermining the authority in a public manner is a sure fire way to ensure that the legal system will use you to reassert it's own authority as an act of long term preservation of the system's status quo.
  - throwaway654329 4y ago
    To call that a legal system and not a systemic political persecution is probably not uniquely American, though it is uniquely on display in this case. Lately with SCOTUS, I think we are seeing widespread dissent about the worth of the entire legal system. For many, the system was already unbelievably unjust simply for the logic of what you observe. That’s just how it is, but is that how it should be?
- refurb 4y ago
  It has to do with restitution and admitting guilt. If you rob a bank, get caught, say sorry and work at restitution you’ll often be given a lighter sentence. Rob a bank then brag that the cops will never catch you and you’re glad you got away with it? Yeah, you’ll get a more severe sentence. The idea is that justice should take restitution and admission of guilt into account.
  - galaxyLogic 4y ago
    > The idea is that justice should take restitution and admission of guilt into account. Doesn't that imply that not admitting guilt is a crime for which you get an extra penalty? Let's assume that is correct and ethical. The question then is how big should such an extra penalty be, for the crime of not agreeing you are guilty? Life in prison? Or perhaps capital punishment? https://www.aclu.org/news/criminal-law-reform/coercive-plea-bargaining-has-poisoned-the-criminal-justice-system-its-time-to-suck-the-venom-out https://www.aclu.org/news/criminal-law-reform/coercive-plea-...
    - refurb 4y ago
      It’s not a crime it’s a consideration taken into account during sentencing.
- pm90 4y ago
  > idk I hate the idea he's not getting released and IIRC he killed noone and robbed noone Then its good that we as a society have institutions that have a better judgement than you, random internet netizen. There’s a reason people wear suits to court and we have all sorts of processes designed to venerate authority. Before modern times, power flowed from the Monarch. Now, we choose our representatives but the instruments by which power is administered still exists.
- etchalon 4y ago
  He didn't get life in prison because he pissed someone off in the government. He got life in prison because the laws he broke called for it.

greenthrow 4y ago

He tried to have people murdered. He ran an illicit marketplace for tons of illegal activity. He deserves life.

throwaway654329 4y ago
In a civilized country such as many developed countries in Europe a life sentence is roughly fifteen to twenty years. That is a remarkably long time. It is an extreme punishment. There are exceptions for psycho killers like Anders Breivik. Ulbrich would be unlikely to fall into the Breivik category. His prison conditions would not be so brutal either, see again Breivik for an example. If you believe he deserves life, do you believe he deserves brutality in prison? He is by many international legal definitions a political prisoner found guilty of what appear as obviously relative political crimes and likely even absolute political crimes. His politics were core to his supposed criminal activities in the war on some drugs. His investigation and prosecution was tainted. Several of the involved officers committed blatant crimes for personal gain for which they were later arrested, charged, and convicted. Those same state agents appear to have alleged the murder for hire, which is somehow not entrapment and yet considered credible. In 1769, William Blackstone said “the law holds that it is better that 10 guilty persons escape, than that 1 innocent suffer (innocent person be convicted).” Morally and in principle, especially in a tainted investigation with misbehaving Government agents, the guilty should be let go. Perhaps you don’t agree - either way, there is an appearance of a two tier legal system. The system that jails Ross but lets very wealthy pharmacy company owners off with thousands of confirmed deaths, people who produced, marketed, and sold similar and sometimes identical drugs exclusively for profit are punished with a fine.
- Nursie 4y ago
  > He is by many international legal definitions a political prisoner No, this is bullshit. He committed several serious crimes and is now paying the price for that. Yes, reform the legal system sensibly. No, we don't let drug kingpins who have built up a serious crime organisation walk.
  - 4y ago

hluska 4y ago

Ross Ulbricht was offered a plea deal before his indictment. The plea called for a minimum sentence of ten years up to a maximum of one life term. He should have taken the plea.