7 ms·

Day 2 Operations with the James Webb Space Telescope is about to begin

125 points by flyingbarron 4y ago

moffkalast 4y ago
Time to see how much damage that micrometeoroid did.
- flyingbarron 4y ago
  I'm pretty sure that if there was any bad news they'd be managing expectations. This is the quiet of confidence, I think :)
  - moffkalast 4y ago
    Here's to hoping :D
- jcims 4y ago
  As long as it didn’t hit any of the actuator mechanism my guess is it probably will just add a bit of noise/bias that they can largely eliminate. https://practicalastrophotography.com/a-brief-guide-to-calibration-frames/ https://practicalastrophotography.com/a-brief-guide-to-calib...
- q1w2 4y ago
  Statistically speaking, it's quite concerning that such a large hit has occurred so soon after launch and thus does not bode well for the predicted lifespan of the telescope. We pray it was an extreme outlier.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- dghughes 4y ago
  It's like when you get a new phone and scratch the screen just taking the screen cover off.
- aortega 4y ago
  I have several telescopes and I have dropped things in the mirrors quite often. The decrease in quality from a damaged mirror is almost zero. You only lose a tiny part of the total surface. Is not like hubble that had the wrong shape. A tiny speck in the mirror is likely undetectable. Even a bigger one wont affect that much.
- windsurfer 4y ago
  A man fired multiple bullets into a telescope and put many holes in the primary mirror, but the science capabilities were only minimally affected: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harlan_J._Smith_Telescope https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harlan_J._Smith_Telescope This telescope design already has a giant hole in the middle, and the light-collecting capabilities are hardly affected by small holes.
  - ianai 4y ago
    I think it's kind of like how FaceID or TouchID work regardless of orientation of face/fingerprint. Or how locating a radio source from data across multiple detectors would utilize math and any damage would drop out as slightly more noise. Modern cameras often have dead pixels in their detectors but they're just skipped in the output photos.
bearjaws 4y ago
- furyofantares 4y ago
  Kinda? But honestly I bet the people who worked on it are excited by the prestige of having the president release them. It'll get way more eyeballs on the event I'm sure, and he's almost certainly going to praise the people who worked on it
- ddalex 4y ago
  Depends on what we see in the images. If we see space structures that are undeniable artificial, spanning tens of billions of light years in size, yes, that would be something that the president would announce.
  - dotnet00 4y ago
    If the telescope saw any undeniably artificial structure billions of light years in size, there would be a lot more to worry about than who announces it. It would effectively be like discovering god given how absurd a size billions of light years is.
- geoffeg 4y ago
  I'm of two minds here. I agree with you but hopefully having Biden involved in the briefing will draw more attention to what I think it one of the coolest large science and engineering projects in decades (just my opinion).
- flyingbarron 4y ago
  I think it emphasizes the importance of the results - it's for everyone, not just scientific types. Back in 1964, President Lyndon Johnson "expressed interest" in the first close-up pictures NASA got from the Moon on Ranger 7. The freshly developed images were loaded onto a plane and the President got a private briefing with the head of NASA on the very same day. (sorry, I don't think I can link the picture) https://history.nasa.gov/SP-4210/pages/Ch_18.htm https://history.nasa.gov/SP-4210/pages/Ch_18.htm
rob74 4y ago
If this "day 2" does not refer to an actual day (which does not have a real meaning if you're not on a planet), but to a phase, why do they call it "day" and not "phase"? Does "phase" have some kind of negative connotation, does it sound too "scientific"?
- flyingbarron 4y ago
  I honestly don't know. Just to clarify, the term "Day-2" isn't from NASA, it's a universal engineering term - which mostly happens on Earth ;) I'm guessing it's just a planning term - like D-Day :shrugs:
  - JacobThreeThree 4y ago
    I see Day-0, Day-1, Day-2 etc. used in the context of business planning quite frequently.
    - GrumpyNl 4y ago
      So its in 3 days?
      - outworlder 4y ago
        No. Day zero is usually prep work. Etc. "Day 2" could be a decade or for as long as the system is maintained.
  - throw0101a 4y ago
    * https://dzone.com/articles/defining-day-2-operations https://dzone.com/articles/defining-day-2-operations * https://about.gitlab.com/solutions/day-2-ops/ https://about.gitlab.com/solutions/day-2-ops/
    - flyingbarron 4y ago
      Still doesn't explain why "Day" and not "Phase" or "Stage" or "Level" or "Period" I think I covered the basic explanation in my article as well as dzone and gitlab did in theirs. :D
nharada 4y ago
I have no technical insight, but I'm SO stoked to see these images tomorrow.
interestica 4y ago
Okay, anyone think it's strange that they pushed back the release at the last minute (to 1730EDT) -- and they have done a pretty poor job of making that obvious on their channels (eg twitter or live NASAtv feed). Strange strange.
- EcLRZjyicBSbwRV 4y ago
  Not particularly, would assume something came up and the briefing needed to be pushed 30 min. Don't think it's particularly strange for the President's schedule to be moved around. As for the tweets, there is a tweet from yesterday: https://twitter.com/NASA/status/1546290906046816256 https://twitter.com/NASA/status/1546290906046816256 What exactly were you looking for?
  - interestica 4y ago
    I was hoping for updates via the channels they released? Not everyone is keeping up on Twitter. It would make sense to make note of the delay on the previously linked NASAtv feed. And an update with a few mins of lead time for when they were going to go Live? Instead, they just cut into it at a random time some 90 mins later. And the tweet you linked to is part of the problem as it features the incorrect time.
- tigershark 4y ago
  45 minutes as of now, it’s getting ridiculous..
  - WaffleIronMaker 4y ago
    Yeah, get a move on!
kibwen 4y ago
In case you haven't seen the first image yet, here's a gif comparison of the first JWST photo with a Hubble photo of the same region of the sky: https://i.redd.it/9uyhwijeo0b91.gif https://i.redd.it/9uyhwijeo0b91.gif EDIT: Better comparison: https://imgsli.com/MTE2Mjc3 https://imgsli.com/MTE2Mjc3

125 points by flyingbarron 4y ago

moffkalast 4y ago

Time to see how much damage that micrometeoroid did.

flyingbarron 4y ago
I'm pretty sure that if there was any bad news they'd be managing expectations. This is the quiet of confidence, I think :)
- moffkalast 4y ago
  Here's to hoping :D
jcims 4y ago
As long as it didn’t hit any of the actuator mechanism my guess is it probably will just add a bit of noise/bias that they can largely eliminate. https://practicalastrophotography.com/a-brief-guide-to-calibration-frames/ https://practicalastrophotography.com/a-brief-guide-to-calib...
q1w2 4y ago
Statistically speaking, it's quite concerning that such a large hit has occurred so soon after launch and thus does not bode well for the predicted lifespan of the telescope. We pray it was an extreme outlier.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
dghughes 4y ago
It's like when you get a new phone and scratch the screen just taking the screen cover off.
aortega 4y ago
I have several telescopes and I have dropped things in the mirrors quite often. The decrease in quality from a damaged mirror is almost zero. You only lose a tiny part of the total surface. Is not like hubble that had the wrong shape. A tiny speck in the mirror is likely undetectable. Even a bigger one wont affect that much.
windsurfer 4y ago
A man fired multiple bullets into a telescope and put many holes in the primary mirror, but the science capabilities were only minimally affected: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harlan_J._Smith_Telescope https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harlan_J._Smith_Telescope This telescope design already has a giant hole in the middle, and the light-collecting capabilities are hardly affected by small holes.
- ianai 4y ago
  I think it's kind of like how FaceID or TouchID work regardless of orientation of face/fingerprint. Or how locating a radio source from data across multiple detectors would utilize math and any damage would drop out as slightly more noise. Modern cameras often have dead pixels in their detectors but they're just skipped in the output photos.

bearjaws 4y ago

furyofantares 4y ago
Kinda? But honestly I bet the people who worked on it are excited by the prestige of having the president release them. It'll get way more eyeballs on the event I'm sure, and he's almost certainly going to praise the people who worked on it
ddalex 4y ago
Depends on what we see in the images. If we see space structures that are undeniable artificial, spanning tens of billions of light years in size, yes, that would be something that the president would announce.
- dotnet00 4y ago
  If the telescope saw any undeniably artificial structure billions of light years in size, there would be a lot more to worry about than who announces it. It would effectively be like discovering god given how absurd a size billions of light years is.
geoffeg 4y ago
I'm of two minds here. I agree with you but hopefully having Biden involved in the briefing will draw more attention to what I think it one of the coolest large science and engineering projects in decades (just my opinion).
flyingbarron 4y ago
I think it emphasizes the importance of the results - it's for everyone, not just scientific types. Back in 1964, President Lyndon Johnson "expressed interest" in the first close-up pictures NASA got from the Moon on Ranger 7. The freshly developed images were loaded onto a plane and the President got a private briefing with the head of NASA on the very same day. (sorry, I don't think I can link the picture) https://history.nasa.gov/SP-4210/pages/Ch_18.htm https://history.nasa.gov/SP-4210/pages/Ch_18.htm

rob74 4y ago

If this "day 2" does not refer to an actual day (which does not have a real meaning if you're not on a planet), but to a phase, why do they call it "day" and not "phase"? Does "phase" have some kind of negative connotation, does it sound too "scientific"?

flyingbarron 4y ago
I honestly don't know. Just to clarify, the term "Day-2" isn't from NASA, it's a universal engineering term - which mostly happens on Earth ;) I'm guessing it's just a planning term - like D-Day :shrugs:
- JacobThreeThree 4y ago
  I see Day-0, Day-1, Day-2 etc. used in the context of business planning quite frequently.
  - GrumpyNl 4y ago
    So its in 3 days?
    - outworlder 4y ago
      No. Day zero is usually prep work. Etc. "Day 2" could be a decade or for as long as the system is maintained.
- throw0101a 4y ago
  * https://dzone.com/articles/defining-day-2-operations https://dzone.com/articles/defining-day-2-operations * https://about.gitlab.com/solutions/day-2-ops/ https://about.gitlab.com/solutions/day-2-ops/
  - flyingbarron 4y ago
    Still doesn't explain why "Day" and not "Phase" or "Stage" or "Level" or "Period" I think I covered the basic explanation in my article as well as dzone and gitlab did in theirs. :D

nharada 4y ago

I have no technical insight, but I'm SO stoked to see these images tomorrow.

interestica 4y ago

Okay, anyone think it's strange that they pushed back the release at the last minute (to 1730EDT) -- and they have done a pretty poor job of making that obvious on their channels (eg twitter or live NASAtv feed). Strange strange.

EcLRZjyicBSbwRV 4y ago
Not particularly, would assume something came up and the briefing needed to be pushed 30 min. Don't think it's particularly strange for the President's schedule to be moved around. As for the tweets, there is a tweet from yesterday: https://twitter.com/NASA/status/1546290906046816256 https://twitter.com/NASA/status/1546290906046816256 What exactly were you looking for?
- interestica 4y ago
  I was hoping for updates via the channels they released? Not everyone is keeping up on Twitter. It would make sense to make note of the delay on the previously linked NASAtv feed. And an update with a few mins of lead time for when they were going to go Live? Instead, they just cut into it at a random time some 90 mins later. And the tweet you linked to is part of the problem as it features the incorrect time.
tigershark 4y ago
45 minutes as of now, it’s getting ridiculous..
- WaffleIronMaker 4y ago
  Yeah, get a move on!

kibwen 4y ago

In case you haven't seen the first image yet, here's a gif comparison of the first JWST photo with a Hubble photo of the same region of the sky: https://i.redd.it/9uyhwijeo0b91.gif https://i.redd.it/9uyhwijeo0b91.gif EDIT: Better comparison: https://imgsli.com/MTE2Mjc3 https://imgsli.com/MTE2Mjc3