4 ms·

Yes, it's a complex issue at publicly funded schools. And frankly, in the US, there is an 'Evangelical' aspect which is weirdly different from more mainstream

Yes, it's a complex issue at publicly funded schools. And frankly, in the US, there is an 'Evangelical' aspect which is weirdly different from more mainstream religions i.e. Jews and Catholics probably have more in common than Evangelicals and Catholics - at least culturally. Anglicans and most Protestants go on the Jewish/Catholic side. Even Islam. A Chapel, a Chaplain, maybe a few religious courses, some influence by the clergy with the school itself, some stricter rules for dorms (i.e. not co-ed etc..) that kind of stuff is one thing ... ... but when everything is 'Gospel Music Only' in the band, 'J for Jesus Cheers', and 'Jesus Revival Rally' before the big game, '4pm Prayer Time', etc. etc.. - it's kind of a another dimension of religiosity entirely. Those kids would be exposed to more integrated religiosity than many of the students at seminary-origin Universities of times past. Oxford Students from hundreds of years ago would think all of that a bit nutty. I suggest there might be a distinction between: 'Goes to Church on Sunday' and 'Everything is Jesus, Hooray!' kinds of affiliations. The later, impossible for public schools, the former, possibly.

barry-cotter 4y ago
> I suggest there might be a distinction between: 'Goes to Church on Sunday' and 'Everything is Jesus, Hooray!' kinds of affiliations. Yes, some affiliations treat the religion as kind of embarrassing or don’t actually demand anything of their adherents that would be even mildly embarrassing with atheist/agnostic friends. Think Reform Judaism/Unitarian Universalism/ Episcopalianism. Others believe their religion means something. > The later, impossible for public schools, the former, possibly. This is actually exactly how the previous dispensation of no religion in public life, judicially started in the US. The Protestants wanted to be able to discriminate against Catholics like you want to be able to discriminate against religions that believe something in tension with the power of the state.
- woevdbz 4y ago
  > Others believe their religion means something. I think you may be confusing finding one's religion to be meaningful with some kind of need to broadcast it. I feel every instant of my life to be infused by my faith, yet because it is personal and does require me to testify outwardly about it, it doesn't usually make me want to discuss it with others. You don't get to judge whether it means something to me or not...
  - barry-cotter 4y ago
    If your religion means something to you but no one can tell by any visible sign it is indistinguishable from having no faith. If you every instant of your life is infused by your faith how does it show? Faith can be meaningful to a person without placing any demands on them. Reform Judaism allows people to maintain a connection with their ethnic heritage while having no content disturbing to a good Democrat. UU gives people who grew up with religion something to do once a week that bears some resemblance to it. Faith can be real while having no effect. Western Therapeutic Buddhism is not the only kind of religion that is all about providing something to the adherent.
    - woevdbz 4y ago
      > If your religion means something to you but no one can tell by any visible sign it is indistinguishable from having no faith. By you, not by me > If you every instant of your life is infused by your faith how does it show? It shows somewhat because I take actions that are in accordance with my faith, but there's no big "tell", it's not particularly easy to distinguish from generally trying to be a good person. Why does faith have to cause embarrassment or discomfort in front of others, or even be shown to others, in order to "matter"? That might apply to evangelist faith or faiths placing emphasis on proselytism, but does not apply to every faith.
- jamiek88 4y ago
  “When you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men … but when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your father who is unseen.” Matthew 6:5-8
  - barry-cotter 4y ago
    “Do not think that I have come to bring peace on earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s foes will be those of his own household.” Matthew 10:34-36

barry-cotter 4y ago

> I suggest there might be a distinction between: 'Goes to Church on Sunday' and 'Everything is Jesus, Hooray!' kinds of affiliations. Yes, some affiliations treat the religion as kind of embarrassing or don’t actually demand anything of their adherents that would be even mildly embarrassing with atheist/agnostic friends. Think Reform Judaism/Unitarian Universalism/ Episcopalianism. Others believe their religion means something. > The later, impossible for public schools, the former, possibly. This is actually exactly how the previous dispensation of no religion in public life, judicially started in the US. The Protestants wanted to be able to discriminate against Catholics like you want to be able to discriminate against religions that believe something in tension with the power of the state.

woevdbz 4y ago
> Others believe their religion means something. I think you may be confusing finding one's religion to be meaningful with some kind of need to broadcast it. I feel every instant of my life to be infused by my faith, yet because it is personal and does require me to testify outwardly about it, it doesn't usually make me want to discuss it with others. You don't get to judge whether it means something to me or not...
- barry-cotter 4y ago
  If your religion means something to you but no one can tell by any visible sign it is indistinguishable from having no faith. If you every instant of your life is infused by your faith how does it show? Faith can be meaningful to a person without placing any demands on them. Reform Judaism allows people to maintain a connection with their ethnic heritage while having no content disturbing to a good Democrat. UU gives people who grew up with religion something to do once a week that bears some resemblance to it. Faith can be real while having no effect. Western Therapeutic Buddhism is not the only kind of religion that is all about providing something to the adherent.
  - woevdbz 4y ago
    > If your religion means something to you but no one can tell by any visible sign it is indistinguishable from having no faith. By you, not by me > If you every instant of your life is infused by your faith how does it show? It shows somewhat because I take actions that are in accordance with my faith, but there's no big "tell", it's not particularly easy to distinguish from generally trying to be a good person. Why does faith have to cause embarrassment or discomfort in front of others, or even be shown to others, in order to "matter"? That might apply to evangelist faith or faiths placing emphasis on proselytism, but does not apply to every faith.
jamiek88 4y ago
“When you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men … but when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your father who is unseen.” Matthew 6:5-8
- barry-cotter 4y ago
  “Do not think that I have come to bring peace on earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s foes will be those of his own household.” Matthew 10:34-36