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Lichess is amazing given how little they receive in funding. The interface is miles ahead of commercial competitors. They also handle guest plays much better.

Lichess is amazing given how little they receive in funding. The interface is miles ahead of commercial competitors. They also handle guest plays much better. I've faced less cheating bots and no annoying pop ups on lichess when playing as a guest compared to chess.com Can anyone point me to how they handle cheating detection? I would love a high level overview of how it works especially when you have no data on the player. fun nugget: HN users hosted tournaments on lichess at the start of the pandemic [0] 0] https://lichess.org/team/hacker-news https://lichess.org/team/hacker-news

sgjohnson 4y ago
> The interface is miles ahead of commercial competitors. I much prefer the chess.com UI
- sib301 4y ago
  Same. I love lichess and I’m so happy it exists, but I prefer the chess.com interface for playing, and analyzing games. Probably because I started there
  - sgjohnson 4y ago
    I play on both sites, but for analysis I almost always import the games into chess.com
    - trungdq88 4y ago
      Can you share what it is that you need to see on chess.com but is not available on lichess? (I use lichess analysis frequently and haven't used chess.com much)
      - bionsystem 4y ago
        I personally think lichess analysis is better : - latest engine, with webassembly or cloud mode - "learn from your mistakes" mode where when there is a drop in valuation of the position, you're given the position and are asked to find a better move ; you can also find bad moves from the opponent which is interesting to help spot mistakes faster Also puzzles are great if you have an account (free), I find the puzzles of great quality, they really match your level and once you get better at solving the common tactics, they look more and more like small studies where you might only get positionnal advantage sometimes (instead of the classic "win material / mate in X moves" type of problem which is a bit redundant after a while). I don't know how they generate puzzles but it seems that a lot of them are from games actually played on the site where only one line seems to give an advantage. I think it's amazing that they do that. High quality puzzles from real games.
- edgyquant 4y ago
  - matsemann 4y ago
    "Those disagreeing with me are wrong". Seriously?
    - edgyquant 4y ago
      Not what I said at all. There’s always comments agreeing with me and I never see an elaboration by the lichess hoards who dominate every thread involving it
mNovak 4y ago
Not sure about lichess specifically, but I know many game servers are a bit cagey about their cheat detection systems, since they don't want to give the cheaters any hints. But as a broad concept, one technique is to compare moves against bot suggested moves. i.e. if a high % of your moves are those that a strong AI would make, something is fishy.
- randomsearch 4y ago
  There’s a much simpler and more effective way. I met someone who had done that work for a chess company, done some ML to detect cheats, and they were surprised how easy it was to detect changes.I’m not going to post the solution but you might be able to guess if you think through the feature space. It’s obvious in retrospect.
bkishan 4y ago
> Can anyone point me to how they handle cheating detection? You can listen to Thibault talk about here [0] 0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZgyVadkgmI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZgyVadkgmI
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
myle 4y ago
It is open source also the neural network that they use for that. It is called Irwin and you can find it on GitHub.
cjbprime 4y ago
I imagine (without research) that it's just "what percentage of your moves are the same as top computer moves", with a threshold.
edgyquant 4y ago
EMIRELADERO 4y ago
They seem to use two projects: Irwin: https://github.com/clarkerubber/irwin https://github.com/clarkerubber/irwin Kaladin: https://github.com/lichess-org/kaladin https://github.com/lichess-org/kaladin

sgjohnson 4y ago

> The interface is miles ahead of commercial competitors. I much prefer the chess.com UI

sib301 4y ago
Same. I love lichess and I’m so happy it exists, but I prefer the chess.com interface for playing, and analyzing games. Probably because I started there
- sgjohnson 4y ago
  I play on both sites, but for analysis I almost always import the games into chess.com
  - trungdq88 4y ago
    Can you share what it is that you need to see on chess.com but is not available on lichess? (I use lichess analysis frequently and haven't used chess.com much)
    - bionsystem 4y ago
      I personally think lichess analysis is better : - latest engine, with webassembly or cloud mode - "learn from your mistakes" mode where when there is a drop in valuation of the position, you're given the position and are asked to find a better move ; you can also find bad moves from the opponent which is interesting to help spot mistakes faster Also puzzles are great if you have an account (free), I find the puzzles of great quality, they really match your level and once you get better at solving the common tactics, they look more and more like small studies where you might only get positionnal advantage sometimes (instead of the classic "win material / mate in X moves" type of problem which is a bit redundant after a while). I don't know how they generate puzzles but it seems that a lot of them are from games actually played on the site where only one line seems to give an advantage. I think it's amazing that they do that. High quality puzzles from real games.
edgyquant 4y ago
- matsemann 4y ago
  "Those disagreeing with me are wrong". Seriously?
  - edgyquant 4y ago
    Not what I said at all. There’s always comments agreeing with me and I never see an elaboration by the lichess hoards who dominate every thread involving it

mNovak 4y ago

Not sure about lichess specifically, but I know many game servers are a bit cagey about their cheat detection systems, since they don't want to give the cheaters any hints. But as a broad concept, one technique is to compare moves against bot suggested moves. i.e. if a high % of your moves are those that a strong AI would make, something is fishy.

randomsearch 4y ago
There’s a much simpler and more effective way. I met someone who had done that work for a chess company, done some ML to detect cheats, and they were surprised how easy it was to detect changes.I’m not going to post the solution but you might be able to guess if you think through the feature space. It’s obvious in retrospect.

bkishan 4y ago

> Can anyone point me to how they handle cheating detection? You can listen to Thibault talk about here [0] 0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZgyVadkgmI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZgyVadkgmI

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

myle 4y ago

It is open source also the neural network that they use for that. It is called Irwin and you can find it on GitHub.

cjbprime 4y ago

I imagine (without research) that it's just "what percentage of your moves are the same as top computer moves", with a threshold.

edgyquant 4y ago

EMIRELADERO 4y ago

They seem to use two projects: Irwin: https://github.com/clarkerubber/irwin https://github.com/clarkerubber/irwin Kaladin: https://github.com/lichess-org/kaladin https://github.com/lichess-org/kaladin