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'sillysaurusx -- I respect your opinions. I know that I respect your opinions because you're able to use HackerNews as a bully pulpit to reach a very wide audie

'sillysaurusx -- I respect your opinions. I know that I respect your opinions because you're able to use HackerNews as a bully pulpit to reach a very wide audience and I personally both enjoy and look forward to seeing your participation. I've often wished I had better opportunities to learn from you and always silently wish you well on your personal journey. I also see from your Twitter reply that you feel HN hasn't necessarily been a great platform for your participation. I just want to counter that feeling with real-world result: I've read hundreds of your comments and at least a dozen of your submissions. I suspect HackerNews is actually a fantastically appropriate platform for you, and not an adversarial one. At any rate, the disconnect between what I perceive as an outside observer vs. what you perceive as a "man in the arena"[0] is a fascinating phenomenon in its own right. 0: https://prisonist.org/quotes-we-love-theodore-roosevelt-man-in-the-arena/ https://prisonist.org/quotes-we-love-theodore-roosevelt-man-...

mgdlbp 4y ago
Context that I had to look up: sillysaurusx on HN is theshawwn on Twitter, whose replies to the submitted tweet this is a response to. (What makes that relative clause so hard to parse?) Meta: Is that an apostrophe as a username sigil? Where did it come from? Another instance: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17681886 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17681886
- yesbabyyes 4y ago
  > Meta: Is that an apostrophe as a username sigil? Where did it originate? It's a LISP-ism. It means don't evaluate the symbol before passing it.
- raldi 4y ago
  The aforementioned replies: https://mobile.twitter.com/theshawwn/status/1282058054754799616 https://mobile.twitter.com/theshawwn/status/1282058054754799...
  - pen2l 4y ago
    That's a tough cookie for sure but sillysauraus is not seeing the big picture. It is tragic that we don't have yummyfajitas' or michaelochurch's takes which went against the grain and were probably interesting in some ways, but they in the end shot themselves in the foot by delivering their message in odiously-scented wrappings. Frequently employing ad hominem attacks, calling women names, etc. quickly evaporates the credibility of the person behind them, sours the culture of the community, and is just not a very good thing to do, irrespective of whatever validity or truth is being conveyed.
    - raldi 4y ago
      MOC was a toxic charlatan who posted exactly the kind of comments that have no place in a well-moderated forum.
    - frenet 4y ago
      That is just because most people leave when they don't like something. In a bad environment you would expect the majority of those who stay to still find the environment good and themselves rational, with only a few outspoken against it. It is a relatively basic concept in markets, sociology, biology, information systems and reasoning. The person you and the comment next to me are talking about is not here to defend themselves. They are specifically not here to defend themselves because they aren't allowed to. The justification for them not being allowed to is because they talked badly about someone else. Yet, it is apparently accepted to talk badly about them. Your are even saying that we shouldn't trust this person because they in your opnion engaged in ad hominem attacks. But by doing so you are arguably performing an ad hominem attack yourself. And while you can certainly make a meta argument against that it would be close enough for many not to touch it. This is why many people leave. Not because it's the Internet. Most of us have been around that. But because it is bad version of it. You might think this doesn't have real consequences so I will give you an example. Because of the environment on Hacker News there is a lack of successful Europeans. This in turn results in there being an overwhelming consensus that is less likely you make good amounts of money in Europe. But this often isn't the case if you know what to do. It is just that those who do either leave or stop talking about it. Which continues the existing narrative as the participants reality continues to match their opinions. While in reality their opinion may not really be supported. An environment with one sided environment isn't harmless. It might actually give you a worse life. But the same argument as before also applies here. Those who appreciate this are the first to leave. Leaving those who stay blind to what is happening.
- permo-w 4y ago
  I read it as a quotation mark. of course there's no closing mark, but it could be a mistake
zamalek 4y ago
The one complaint is this: > He has had a habit of silencing some long-standing members of HN If anything, that shows excellent moderation skills. Everyone should abide by the same rules.
- ryandrake 4y ago
  Ye, we really don’t want a “HN Royalty” clique that are immune to moderation. You see that on Reddit and it does not tend to elevate the conversation.
- PragmaticPulp 4y ago
  One thing I learned from moderating an internet community in the past: Some of the long-term users had become experts at skirting the rules. They had seen so many posts and watched so many other people get moderated that they learned how to walk right up to the line without explicitly crossing it. Some times they'd become very good at baiting other people into breaking the rules. Or they would writing extremely inflammatory comments in a pseudo-cordial writing style that looked friendly/naïve but was actually crafted to incite a flame war. There was a lot of "You should know better" admonishing these provocateur forum members, but for many the only solution was to remove them from the forum completely.
  - doogerdog 4y ago
    A couple of very good computer forums that I depended on years ago were slowly destroyed by "long term users". A small group seemed to think that their long history and prolific posting made it their playground. Little by little it became less worth my time to check it out every day. This place is always worth a glance. Every day. On the best discussions you can sense that people only post if they feel they really have something to add. I love what Dang refers to as HN's non-silowed nature. It is easy to find useful and fascinating discussions on any topic. When I have the time and energy, sometimes I dive in for a few hours. When I come up for air I'm tired but generally pleased with experience. A common complaint here is that it ain't what it used to be. There may be a little more fluff now but when it's good - It's darn good.
wodenokoto 4y ago
I’m out of the loop. Who is this person and why was he banned?

mgdlbp 4y ago

Context that I had to look up: sillysaurusx on HN is theshawwn on Twitter, whose replies to the submitted tweet this is a response to. (What makes that relative clause so hard to parse?) Meta: Is that an apostrophe as a username sigil? Where did it come from? Another instance: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17681886 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17681886

yesbabyyes 4y ago
> Meta: Is that an apostrophe as a username sigil? Where did it originate? It's a LISP-ism. It means don't evaluate the symbol before passing it.
raldi 4y ago
The aforementioned replies: https://mobile.twitter.com/theshawwn/status/1282058054754799616 https://mobile.twitter.com/theshawwn/status/1282058054754799...
- pen2l 4y ago
  That's a tough cookie for sure but sillysauraus is not seeing the big picture. It is tragic that we don't have yummyfajitas' or michaelochurch's takes which went against the grain and were probably interesting in some ways, but they in the end shot themselves in the foot by delivering their message in odiously-scented wrappings. Frequently employing ad hominem attacks, calling women names, etc. quickly evaporates the credibility of the person behind them, sours the culture of the community, and is just not a very good thing to do, irrespective of whatever validity or truth is being conveyed.
  - raldi 4y ago
    MOC was a toxic charlatan who posted exactly the kind of comments that have no place in a well-moderated forum.
  - frenet 4y ago
    That is just because most people leave when they don't like something. In a bad environment you would expect the majority of those who stay to still find the environment good and themselves rational, with only a few outspoken against it. It is a relatively basic concept in markets, sociology, biology, information systems and reasoning. The person you and the comment next to me are talking about is not here to defend themselves. They are specifically not here to defend themselves because they aren't allowed to. The justification for them not being allowed to is because they talked badly about someone else. Yet, it is apparently accepted to talk badly about them. Your are even saying that we shouldn't trust this person because they in your opnion engaged in ad hominem attacks. But by doing so you are arguably performing an ad hominem attack yourself. And while you can certainly make a meta argument against that it would be close enough for many not to touch it. This is why many people leave. Not because it's the Internet. Most of us have been around that. But because it is bad version of it. You might think this doesn't have real consequences so I will give you an example. Because of the environment on Hacker News there is a lack of successful Europeans. This in turn results in there being an overwhelming consensus that is less likely you make good amounts of money in Europe. But this often isn't the case if you know what to do. It is just that those who do either leave or stop talking about it. Which continues the existing narrative as the participants reality continues to match their opinions. While in reality their opinion may not really be supported. An environment with one sided environment isn't harmless. It might actually give you a worse life. But the same argument as before also applies here. Those who appreciate this are the first to leave. Leaving those who stay blind to what is happening.
permo-w 4y ago
I read it as a quotation mark. of course there's no closing mark, but it could be a mistake

zamalek 4y ago

The one complaint is this: > He has had a habit of silencing some long-standing members of HN If anything, that shows excellent moderation skills. Everyone should abide by the same rules.

ryandrake 4y ago
Ye, we really don’t want a “HN Royalty” clique that are immune to moderation. You see that on Reddit and it does not tend to elevate the conversation.
PragmaticPulp 4y ago
One thing I learned from moderating an internet community in the past: Some of the long-term users had become experts at skirting the rules. They had seen so many posts and watched so many other people get moderated that they learned how to walk right up to the line without explicitly crossing it. Some times they'd become very good at baiting other people into breaking the rules. Or they would writing extremely inflammatory comments in a pseudo-cordial writing style that looked friendly/naïve but was actually crafted to incite a flame war. There was a lot of "You should know better" admonishing these provocateur forum members, but for many the only solution was to remove them from the forum completely.
- doogerdog 4y ago
  A couple of very good computer forums that I depended on years ago were slowly destroyed by "long term users". A small group seemed to think that their long history and prolific posting made it their playground. Little by little it became less worth my time to check it out every day. This place is always worth a glance. Every day. On the best discussions you can sense that people only post if they feel they really have something to add. I love what Dang refers to as HN's non-silowed nature. It is easy to find useful and fascinating discussions on any topic. When I have the time and energy, sometimes I dive in for a few hours. When I come up for air I'm tired but generally pleased with experience. A common complaint here is that it ain't what it used to be. There may be a little more fluff now but when it's good - It's darn good.

wodenokoto 4y ago

I’m out of the loop. Who is this person and why was he banned?