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> Second, both Russia and Soviet Union before were the most reliable energy partner. They didn't fail their obligations a single time. Sorry, this is bollocks.

> Second, both Russia and Soviet Union before were the most reliable energy partner. They didn't fail their obligations a single time. Sorry, this is bollocks. For more than 30 years Russia is using energy supplies as a weapon against pretty much all the eastern and central Europe.

tut-urut-utut 4y ago
Can you give one single example when it was Russia's guilt for not delivering gas? The only time when we had issue with gas it was some ten years ago when Ukraine stopped the transit hoping to blackmail both Russia and the EU to get a better deal for themselves. Ukraine was a failed state then that couldn't pay for gas they used.
- throw_a_grenade 4y ago
  First well published incident was cutting off Estonia in 1993, right after it regained independence. Note Russia always does something to shift the blame, usually starts "dispute" over payments. It's done because media need to report ”balanced" view, so just by reading general news it's not apparent tha this is really blackmail. Stockholm tribunal regularly disproves Russian version, it just takes time, which is what Russia is after: you can't survive winter without heating, and the final verdict won't arrive in time. So until LNG terminals and pipelines to Norway sprang around the Baltic Sea, coupled with Third Package, Eastern Europeans mostly had to yield to this blackmail. > The only time when we had issue with gas ISTM you live west of Oder. No one in Eastern Europe would say this. > it was some ten years ago when Ukraine stopped the transit hoping to blackmail both Russia and the EU to get a better deal for themselves. Ukraine was a failed state then that couldn't pay for gas they used. This is false, Ukraine wasn't "failed state". What failed was an attempt to rig an election.
  - tut-urut-utut 4y ago
    It is a failed state. Or call it a puppet state. After the Maidan coup it became pretty fast s fascist autocracy. And it was corrupt since the gain of independence. How else would you call it? A pinnacle of democracy certainly not.
    - dragonwriter 4y ago
      > After the Maidan coup it became pretty fast s fascist autocracy I think you are confusing Ukraine after Maidan with Russia under Putin. (Well, no, I really think you are just parroting laughably dumb Russian propaganda, but it would be more accurate with those substitutions.)

tut-urut-utut 4y ago

Can you give one single example when it was Russia's guilt for not delivering gas? The only time when we had issue with gas it was some ten years ago when Ukraine stopped the transit hoping to blackmail both Russia and the EU to get a better deal for themselves. Ukraine was a failed state then that couldn't pay for gas they used.

throw_a_grenade 4y ago
First well published incident was cutting off Estonia in 1993, right after it regained independence. Note Russia always does something to shift the blame, usually starts "dispute" over payments. It's done because media need to report ”balanced" view, so just by reading general news it's not apparent tha this is really blackmail. Stockholm tribunal regularly disproves Russian version, it just takes time, which is what Russia is after: you can't survive winter without heating, and the final verdict won't arrive in time. So until LNG terminals and pipelines to Norway sprang around the Baltic Sea, coupled with Third Package, Eastern Europeans mostly had to yield to this blackmail. > The only time when we had issue with gas ISTM you live west of Oder. No one in Eastern Europe would say this. > it was some ten years ago when Ukraine stopped the transit hoping to blackmail both Russia and the EU to get a better deal for themselves. Ukraine was a failed state then that couldn't pay for gas they used. This is false, Ukraine wasn't "failed state". What failed was an attempt to rig an election.
- tut-urut-utut 4y ago
  It is a failed state. Or call it a puppet state. After the Maidan coup it became pretty fast s fascist autocracy. And it was corrupt since the gain of independence. How else would you call it? A pinnacle of democracy certainly not.
  - dragonwriter 4y ago
    > After the Maidan coup it became pretty fast s fascist autocracy I think you are confusing Ukraine after Maidan with Russia under Putin. (Well, no, I really think you are just parroting laughably dumb Russian propaganda, but it would be more accurate with those substitutions.)