5 ms·

Nobody Knows How Well Homework Works

• gxt 4y ago
  Homework is what someone overworked would come up with to force everyone, wether they need it or not, to put X amount of time repeating and practicing Y. I think it's a frustrating experience overall and we should be looking at giving students the entire curriculum from elementary to masters degree upfront and letting them work up from it at their rythm. As incentive students should be provided X years of access to teachers free of charge, and if you finish early pocket the difference. If you finish late you have to pay the difference.
  • delinquenz 4y ago
    But that would mainly benefit kids from educated backgrounds, while kids who graduate late because of their life circumstances, might end up simply not finishing school or start their professional life in debt. After reading some of the school- and homework-critic posts here and thinking I‘d agree with them I realize that school helps the overall population, especially less educated people who simply wouldn‘t invest more their time and energy in education otherwise while the highly curious and intelligent people are rather limited by it.
• MerelyMortal 4y ago
  In college I had a class where 25% of the final grade was Exam One, 25% Exam Two, 25% Exam Three, and 25% Homework. I got 100s on all of the exams, but never did any homework, so I got a C for the class. In later semesters, I realized I could convince professors to give me a higher letter grade than what the sylabus prescribed, but for that class, oh well.
  • Silica6149 4y ago
    For doing well on exams but not the homework? If so that's very lenient of them, but understandable. I prefer professors just make homework extra credit and make exams a large part of the grade.
  • caminante 4y ago
    But you prepped for the exams, right? That's the equivalent of homework. If not, then your situation is an extreme outlier.
    • hatmatrix 4y ago
      There are many types of homework and undoubtedly some are not useful. These fall into the category which we often refer to as "busywork" - they are assigned for the sake of assigning homework because that's what instructors feel they should do. The useful kind of homework we can categorize as being helpful for the exam, and those which are useful even beyond the exam. In principle, they should be correlated, but there are also many ways to create useless exams too.
      • caminante 4y ago
        Be honest. How often would you expect to do zero homework assignments throughout a course and get straight 100s on all of the exams? That's the parent's claim that they did no HW and got 100s on the exams. Debating whether different HW assignments have varying ROI is a different issue.
    • MerelyMortal 4y ago
      No. I didn't study at all and graduated from a major state university with an engineering degree. If I had to do it all over again, I would take it more seriously. (I am not an engineer. I just thought an engineering degree would be the most practical to take/learn. I could have learned more, but at the time, I didn't have the desire to.)
  • dam_broke_it 4y ago
    How far back is this?? College in the 90s, I had very little homework outside of papers and programming assignments....
    • MerelyMortal 4y ago
      Around 2010
• pacarvalho 4y ago
  This is a fairly complex topic. In my youth, I certainly didn't enjoy homework. Even in subjects I was passionate about. I much rather study the topics that interested me in my own way and pace than doing assigned problems from a textbook. Even if that meant doing all the problems from the textbook lol More recently I discovered that the school I went to abolished homework. Kids there are supposed to complete all school activities within the allotted school time only. However, homework may be valuable in the case where the student would otherwise not study on their own...
  • derbOac 4y ago
    It's complicated further now by gamification. My daughter's school doesn't assign homework until a certain grade, and minimally at all. But they're encouraged to use many apps on different subjects that are structured as games, which she really likes. Reading this post, I realized it's very fuzzy whether she's doing homework: she's not doing it in the traditional sense, but if you include these apps, which cover all the same content, she's doing them all the time.
• phailhaus 4y ago
  Homework, as imperfect as it can be, is still practice. There's always value in practicing something you learned, preferably by being challenged to answer questions you're not used to.
  • bawolff 4y ago
    Opportunity costs are a thing. Making children hate school is also a real risk.
    • origin_path 4y ago
• caramelcustard 4y ago
  In my opinion, homework is first and foremost should be about two things: the first one is being able to problem solve, research and study on your own (developing your own "style" of studying so to speak) and being able to apply the studied knowledge outside of spaces that you're used to apply the knowledge at (classrooms). Given that remote learning and homeschooling are going to only increase in popularity, i wonder if blurring the line between the actual "classwork" and "homework" would have any sort of a positive effect on applying and retaining the knowledge.
  • Silica6149 4y ago
    That's one benefit of homework, but the thing is I've never been really taught skills for problem solving or how to study. For example, most students just reread in order to study for exams but that's been found to be the least helpful method. Shouldn't school teach study methods and problem solving strategies first, before assigning homework?
    • caramelcustard 4y ago
      That's a good question. I think that you're supposed to "develop" those strategies on your own as you attempt to resolve a problem, but i don't think that it works as well as everyone expects it to because when you're young you're always going to have something more interesting to do than some task that is associated with school (skewl sux1!!), meaning that instead of getting any meaningful result, you are going to attempt to accomplish the task as quickly as possible, so you can do what you want. The dilemma of the school system is: if you try to go by the book, provide as much knowledge as possible in the shortest amounts of time – you're going to have to resort to lots and lots of homework. That isn't going to be welcomed by many (because Billy read on the Internet that skewl is ackshually made so ur gonna work at like...uhhh factory and...and...uhhh...homework SUCKS). You could also abolish all the homework, resort to gamification, teach solely the basics (and don't forget da taxes (and who cares if taxation differs by the state/industry)) but at that point what would the point of school be then?
  • bawolff 4y ago
    I don't think that describes any of the homework i got at the high school or middle school level.
• tailspin2019 4y ago
  In my early teens I was really frustrated by the amount of homework I had to do and how much time I felt it stole away from my outside interests and hobbies. Looking back, I was right to think that way because my entire career has been built on things I taught myself via those hobbies and interests. Not even indirectly. Completely directly linked. Even thinking objectively about the meta skills that “homework” may teach you, I still think it has accounted for 5-10% of my useful professional/life skills vs my own adolescent interests (programming, electronics, music production and entrepreneurial stuff) which I peg at 90-95%.
  • Silica6149 4y ago
    If anything, the only thing homework achieves is to make children used to being forced to do something for the sake of doing it. People learn what they want to learn, children that aren't interested in the material can finish homework assignments but not retain anything.
    • Khelavaster 4y ago
      Teaches children to triage what they're required to do, to get the bare minimum done without hurting themselves too badly.
  • nicbou 4y ago
    I had the same experience in university. It felt like the workload got in the way of learning the stuff I was here to learn. I had no time to be curious.
  • mandmandam 4y ago
    100%, and I'd go even further. The time I spent playing video games was better for my development all round than my time spent doing homework. The time I spent reading was far better. The time I spent outside playing was likely even better again, in my particular case. I question the legitimacy of a system which teaches the scientific method yet kills millions of years of child development with utterly unproven busy work.
• newbie2020 4y ago
  Homework has always been extremely helpful for me. I learned a lot of the harder concepts that require more time and thought via homework. But this depends on good teachers curating the right problems/questions. To each their own I guess
• mandmandam 4y ago
  Finland assigns the least homework, and gets the best educational outcomes. https://in-finland.education/homework-in-finland-school/ https://in-finland.education/homework-in-finland-school/ While "the success of education system in Finland is provided by many factors, starting from poverty rates in the country to parental leave policies to the availability of preschools", the above still seems pretty cut and dry.
  • d1sxeyes 4y ago
    I think the problem highlighted by OP is that we don't have proper data on homework. At best, the stats you share show that 'it is possible to deliver the best global educational outcomes without giving children homework'. We don't have proper data on whether these educational outcomes could be further improved by assigning more homework. I think Finland is not a particularly helpful example to share here, specifically because they're widely lauded for having an excellent educational system across the board, they could quite easily still be world-leading even if they've got it wrong on homework (although I accept it probably means that the best education researchers have likely considered the homework question in Finland and have come to a position on it). From a personal perspective, I think there are a lot of factors to whether homework is useful. For example, in a former life I was a languages teacher, and I saw the children I worked with for one or two hours a week. In order to learn vocabulary, without a doubt the most effective method I've ever used is spaced repetition. My best chance of teaching vocab items is to open the lesson by introducing them, a mini-recap at the end of the lesson (maybe a memory quiz, etc.) and then for the children to review themselves at some point before the next lesson. I would imagine similar techniques would be useful in most subjects. Anecdotally, I saw faster and more secure progress from those children who had done the homework. Additionally, those children who had done the homework tended to be better behaved, more responsive to 'course-correcting' when they got distracted, and were able to exhibit better self-control... obviously all of this carries a heavy caveat that this may be WHY they were more compliant with the homework, rather than a consequence of it. However, with a bit of common sense (and to be clear, I have not searched for evidence for the below, and it may well not exist), it seems to me: 1. There are some things where short stints of 'self-learning' are clearly beneficial, and it is either not possible or not an effective use of time to do this during teacher-led lessons (eg: vocabulary/rote learning, independent reading of literature, etc.). 2. A requirement to do some task which does not lead to immediate gratification builds a habit of doing things that are not necessarily fun just because they need to be done 3. Learning to be able to self-manage and complete tasks by a deadline is a skill to develop on its own 4. Learning how to cope with not having completed a task just before the deadline is also an important skill ('can I get away with very quickly doing this in the break before the lesson? can I copy from someone else? should I admit to the teacher that I haven't done it? should I make up an excuse?' etc.) - as long as it's relatively rare 5. Excessive amounts of homework which interfere with a child's private life/free time/etc. are unlikely to be helpful - between 0-5 hours a week total across all subjects seems like a fair amount. 6. Schools should take care to co-ordinate homework so that it's balanced throughout the week (eg: giving 3 hours of homework to be completed on Monday night and none for the rest of the week is not sensible). 7. Teachers should not use homework as an excuse for not planning time properly in a lesson ('oh we're out of time, please finish this at home') NB: Edited for formatting.
• SilverBirch 4y ago
  One topic not discussed here, is that the function of homework is not only to increase attainment in the topic. I work hard. I strongly believe my hard work is a significant factor in my success. I didn't always work hard. In my GCSE exams (16 year olds UK Exams) I got a mixed bag of results, I didn't particularly work very hard. At AS level (17 year olds) I kind of realised that if I didn't start working hard I was not going to get good results. I started working seriously hard, particularly self-teaching the parts of my subjects that were particularly poorly taught by my school. I went on to get straight A grades (highest grade available at the time) in both my AS levels, A levels, and a first class masters degree from a top university. The role of homework can be to teach children the value of hard work and to teach them the skills and habits that are needed to be successful adults, that is more about culture than what grade you actually got in your middle-school algebra class. These skills and attitudes are also very difficult to pick up later in life.
  • Khelavaster 4y ago
    Homework taught me to physically suffer and degrade myself to the extent I couldn't avoid it. Can't imagine how it encourages positive work ethic.
• JackMorgan 4y ago
  This is one of many many things about the American education system that is completely done without any scientific proof of efficacy. Often when there is data, the data proves it doesn't work, but we "have always done it this way". Our education system is shockingly out of step with modern life, yet we do it this way simply through inertia. Consider our system pretty much hasn't changed since the industrial revolution, and was designed to produce factory drones. See New York state teacher of the year John Gatto for more: https://www.cantrip.org/gatto.html https://www.cantrip.org/gatto.html "Look again at the six lessons of school. This is training for permanent underclasses, people who are to be deprived forever of finding the center of their own special genius. And it is training shaken loose from its original logic: to regulate the poor. Since the 1920s the growth of the well-articulated school bureaucracy, and the less visible growth of a horde of industries that profit from schooling exactly as it is, have enlarged schooling's original grasp to seize the sons and daughters of the middle class. "
• cafard 4y ago
  I go from the article back to the HN comments, and discover that in fact Everybody knows how well homework works. Scott Alexander just asked the wrong people. My impression is that it depends. I have got myself unstuck by doing every damn exercise in the book, checking the ones with solutions in the back, and seeing where I went wrong if I did. I have also seen terrible homework that was simply a time sink.