4 ms·

Am I the only one who thinks that the "ethics" part of philosophy is kind of trivial? The only part of philosophy which took me a long time to form a clear opin

Am I the only one who thinks that the "ethics" part of philosophy is kind of trivial? The only part of philosophy which took me a long time to form a clear opinion on was the hard problem of consciousness and related topics.

golergka 4y ago
You're definitely not the only one, but most people who share this opinion didn't study ethics well enough. Its a field full of complicated contradictions.
acoard 4y ago
As a philosophy major who was never particularly interested in ethics, I certainly don't think it's trivial. If you trivial as in "clearly obvious" then I certainly disagree. But let me try and charitably interpret your position. I do think that in practice the different ethical systems don't produce wildly different outcomes, from utilitarianism to deontology to even virtue ethics. Of course, in the realm of thought experiments they can be widely different. But in the real world, the hardest thing is to be moral (i.e. do the right thing) rather than defining your ethics (having a clear code). In practice, the "evil"/conflict/strive in the world I see is due to selfishness or amorality, not disagreements between utilitarians and kantians. Is this what you're getting at? That the distinctions between the different ethical systems collapse into similar practical situations? That being a "good person" is more important than the particular ethical code you follow? (That's my take, basically). I'll also say that I found meta-ethics incredibly illuminating. It essentially builds up a language to discuss different ethical systems and makes conversations around them way easier. Big up on consciousness and philosophy of mind though. I also found philosophy of science fascinating. And shoutout to Hobbes! He would have loved HN, he was such a contrarian.
- RivieraKid 4y ago
  My main point is that ethics is subjective, there's no correct answer to ethical problems, it boils down to how people feel. See also my other comment. I absolutely agree that in the real world it's mainly about being a good person, not about being a particular type of a good person.
charles_f 4y ago
There is a lot to it in the grey area. Don't kill, don't steal, don't cheat, don't eat baby seals, don't touch my grandma, that is trivial. The complex bit is for everything that's less of a drastic decision. Is it ethical to let a coworker make a mistake you saw so they can learn, at the cost of project progress, or is it ethical to help them and make sure you deliver what was promised to your stakeholders on time? What if you don't like the co-worker? What if you dont like stakeholders? Is it ethical to slack off at work if you need that for your mental safety? Or is it theft? And so on. Tons of little decisions that are not about life and death, but still very much about ethics, and that are not trivial at all.
- RivieraKid 4y ago
  My view is that ethics is subjective, it boils down to how people feel. They often have various ethical systems and rules built on those feelings (or on axioms which feel right).
  - mcguire 4y ago
    That is true of all of philosophy (he says, at the risk of his Junior Philosopher's Secret Decoder Ring). The interesting part is the systems you build (hopefully using logic) around it.
    - RivieraKid 4y ago
      I wouldn't even call it philosophy. It's more psychology or anthropology because you're studying emotional responses of the human species. If a serial killer feels that killing for fun is morally right and builds an ethical system on top of those feelings, is that philosophy?
ncmncm 4y ago
You are in luck: there is no problem of consciousness.

golergka 4y ago

You're definitely not the only one, but most people who share this opinion didn't study ethics well enough. Its a field full of complicated contradictions.

acoard 4y ago

As a philosophy major who was never particularly interested in ethics, I certainly don't think it's trivial. If you trivial as in "clearly obvious" then I certainly disagree. But let me try and charitably interpret your position. I do think that in practice the different ethical systems don't produce wildly different outcomes, from utilitarianism to deontology to even virtue ethics. Of course, in the realm of thought experiments they can be widely different. But in the real world, the hardest thing is to be moral (i.e. do the right thing) rather than defining your ethics (having a clear code). In practice, the "evil"/conflict/strive in the world I see is due to selfishness or amorality, not disagreements between utilitarians and kantians. Is this what you're getting at? That the distinctions between the different ethical systems collapse into similar practical situations? That being a "good person" is more important than the particular ethical code you follow? (That's my take, basically). I'll also say that I found meta-ethics incredibly illuminating. It essentially builds up a language to discuss different ethical systems and makes conversations around them way easier. Big up on consciousness and philosophy of mind though. I also found philosophy of science fascinating. And shoutout to Hobbes! He would have loved HN, he was such a contrarian.

RivieraKid 4y ago
My main point is that ethics is subjective, there's no correct answer to ethical problems, it boils down to how people feel. See also my other comment. I absolutely agree that in the real world it's mainly about being a good person, not about being a particular type of a good person.

charles_f 4y ago

There is a lot to it in the grey area. Don't kill, don't steal, don't cheat, don't eat baby seals, don't touch my grandma, that is trivial. The complex bit is for everything that's less of a drastic decision. Is it ethical to let a coworker make a mistake you saw so they can learn, at the cost of project progress, or is it ethical to help them and make sure you deliver what was promised to your stakeholders on time? What if you don't like the co-worker? What if you dont like stakeholders? Is it ethical to slack off at work if you need that for your mental safety? Or is it theft? And so on. Tons of little decisions that are not about life and death, but still very much about ethics, and that are not trivial at all.

RivieraKid 4y ago
My view is that ethics is subjective, it boils down to how people feel. They often have various ethical systems and rules built on those feelings (or on axioms which feel right).
- mcguire 4y ago
  That is true of all of philosophy (he says, at the risk of his Junior Philosopher's Secret Decoder Ring). The interesting part is the systems you build (hopefully using logic) around it.
  - RivieraKid 4y ago
    I wouldn't even call it philosophy. It's more psychology or anthropology because you're studying emotional responses of the human species. If a serial killer feels that killing for fun is morally right and builds an ethical system on top of those feelings, is that philosophy?

ncmncm 4y ago

You are in luck: there is no problem of consciousness.