4 ms·

Heres the interesting thing though. A majority of Indian citizens would agree with this overreach. If the majority agrees with heavy handed tactics and they are

Heres the interesting thing though. A majority of Indian citizens would agree with this overreach. If the majority agrees with heavy handed tactics and they are enforced by elected officials with at least reasonably fair elections then is it right to call it an autocracy? I don’t agree with any of this of course but it is unfortunate reality here.

tedivm 4y ago
- devin 4y ago
  Not sure what you’re referring to. A majority certainly does not approve of overturning Roe, quite the opposite.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - jasonlotito 4y ago
    In polls they don't, but in practice, the majority voted for this outcome.
    - mehlmao 4y ago
      Democratic candidates won the popular vote in 2000, 2008, 2012, 2016, and 2020.
      - jasonlotito 4y ago
        Sorry, but those are people who went to the polls. Those who could vote but did not go to the polls voted for the winner. Voting by abstaining is still voting. If you include the voting population that did not vote in the tally, they effectively voted for this outcome. And before you complain, that's exactly what I was talking about. That's what we are talking about.
  - Gurgler 4y ago
    - hn_tw_away_943 4y ago
  - ridiculous_leke 4y ago
    Are there any legitimate polls to back this up? An average American on the internet is probably against the ruling, but that still doesn't mean that the majority of Americans are against it. If that was the case, we should have either seen pressure building up on "pro-life" states or a BLM style movement in favor of legalizing abortion. But I don't see neither.
    - lazyasciiart 4y ago
      Yes, lots of them, dating back years. A quick search gives me results of polls run by NPR, Washington Post, Gallup, CNN, Pew Research, NBC and CBS, to start with. The clear majority of Americans are in favor of legal abortion.
      - Gurgler 4y ago
    - InitialLastName 4y ago
      > Are there any legitimate polls to back this up? A number of legitimate polls have found substantial majorities/pluralities opposing the ruling [0]. > should have either seen pressure building up on "pro-life" states On the one hand, I've definitely seen this pressure at the grassroots. On the other hand, there has probably been significant geographic sorting, especially as the states that are leaning towards de jure abortion bans have been trending that way de facto for years, likely driving people that care about the issue to friendlier states. > or a BLM style movement in favor of legalizing abortion. Give it a minute, abortion was a legally protected right until 2 weeks ago. [0] https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/americans-views-on-abortion-are-pretty-stagnant-their-views-on-the-supreme-court-are-not/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/americans-views-on-abor...
mrkstu 4y ago
Tyranny of the majority.
sateesh 4y ago
The phenomenon what you mention is called "Tyranny of Majority", great many thinkers have indeed weighed on this.
- Gurgler 4y ago
  Fear of such a tyranny of the majority is why the founders of the US created the electoral college, and apportioned the Senate as it is, creating a republic instead of a pure democracy. It also describes the original ideological distinction between Republicans and Democrats, the two main political parties in the US. James Madison described a scenario like this in his Federalist Paper #10. "Complaints are everywhere ... that the public good is disregarded in the conflicts of rival parties, and that measures are too often decided, not according to the rules of justice and the rights of the minor party, but by the superior force of an interested and overbearing majority."
- throwaway_62022 4y ago
  Folks belonging to majority can get caught on the wrong side of the fence too - https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/editor-arrested-for-outraging-muslims-1607256.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/editor-arreste... I believe the problem is laws related to religion and hate speech. They are stupid. Section 295 is non-bailable offence and can be easily abused by either side to placate group that feels offended. The discussions about India sliding into authoritarian is interesting because strictly speaking many of these laws are pretty old. I wish that these laws did not exist but strictly speaking these laws have been abused to placate Hindus, Muslims, Christians(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weeping_crucifix_in_Mumbai https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weeping_crucifix_in_Mumbai) at different times.

tedivm 4y ago

devin 4y ago
Not sure what you’re referring to. A majority certainly does not approve of overturning Roe, quite the opposite.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- jasonlotito 4y ago
  In polls they don't, but in practice, the majority voted for this outcome.
  - mehlmao 4y ago
    Democratic candidates won the popular vote in 2000, 2008, 2012, 2016, and 2020.
    - jasonlotito 4y ago
      Sorry, but those are people who went to the polls. Those who could vote but did not go to the polls voted for the winner. Voting by abstaining is still voting. If you include the voting population that did not vote in the tally, they effectively voted for this outcome. And before you complain, that's exactly what I was talking about. That's what we are talking about.
- Gurgler 4y ago
  - hn_tw_away_943 4y ago
- ridiculous_leke 4y ago
  Are there any legitimate polls to back this up? An average American on the internet is probably against the ruling, but that still doesn't mean that the majority of Americans are against it. If that was the case, we should have either seen pressure building up on "pro-life" states or a BLM style movement in favor of legalizing abortion. But I don't see neither.
  - lazyasciiart 4y ago
    Yes, lots of them, dating back years. A quick search gives me results of polls run by NPR, Washington Post, Gallup, CNN, Pew Research, NBC and CBS, to start with. The clear majority of Americans are in favor of legal abortion.
    - Gurgler 4y ago
  - InitialLastName 4y ago
    > Are there any legitimate polls to back this up? A number of legitimate polls have found substantial majorities/pluralities opposing the ruling [0]. > should have either seen pressure building up on "pro-life" states On the one hand, I've definitely seen this pressure at the grassroots. On the other hand, there has probably been significant geographic sorting, especially as the states that are leaning towards de jure abortion bans have been trending that way de facto for years, likely driving people that care about the issue to friendlier states. > or a BLM style movement in favor of legalizing abortion. Give it a minute, abortion was a legally protected right until 2 weeks ago. [0] https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/americans-views-on-abortion-are-pretty-stagnant-their-views-on-the-supreme-court-are-not/ https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/americans-views-on-abor...

mrkstu 4y ago

Tyranny of the majority.

sateesh 4y ago

The phenomenon what you mention is called "Tyranny of Majority", great many thinkers have indeed weighed on this.

Gurgler 4y ago
Fear of such a tyranny of the majority is why the founders of the US created the electoral college, and apportioned the Senate as it is, creating a republic instead of a pure democracy. It also describes the original ideological distinction between Republicans and Democrats, the two main political parties in the US. James Madison described a scenario like this in his Federalist Paper #10. "Complaints are everywhere ... that the public good is disregarded in the conflicts of rival parties, and that measures are too often decided, not according to the rules of justice and the rights of the minor party, but by the superior force of an interested and overbearing majority."
throwaway_62022 4y ago
Folks belonging to majority can get caught on the wrong side of the fence too - https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/editor-arrested-for-outraging-muslims-1607256.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/editor-arreste... I believe the problem is laws related to religion and hate speech. They are stupid. Section 295 is non-bailable offence and can be easily abused by either side to placate group that feels offended. The discussions about India sliding into authoritarian is interesting because strictly speaking many of these laws are pretty old. I wish that these laws did not exist but strictly speaking these laws have been abused to placate Hindus, Muslims, Christians(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weeping_crucifix_in_Mumbai https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weeping_crucifix_in_Mumbai) at different times.