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> Yes the underlying (if true) behavior is bad too. Not just bad, but illegal. If Tesla is losing court cases — which they are — then that’s because the judge

> Yes the underlying (if true) behavior is bad too. Not just bad, but illegal. If Tesla is losing court cases — which they are — then that’s because the judge and jury believe based on the evidence presented and argued that Tesla, as a company, was at fault. If it’s happened, they SHOULD be sued. No ifs ands or buts about it. > We should at least consider the possibility this is just a bunch of lowlifes trying to cash in with lawsuits No, we don’t need to consider that possibility. Judges and juries, who have actually seen the evidence (moreso than you or me), have repeatedly considered that possibility and repudiated it. Keep in mind Tesla has some of the absolute best legal representation money and reputation can buy. If the claimants’ stories had any exploitable openings for doubt, Tesla’s lawyers would have absolutely (and skillfully) used them to deflect culpability. The fact they are still losing says something.

ETH_start 4y ago
>>If Tesla is losing court cases — which they are — then that’s because the judge and jury believe based on the evidence presented and argued that Tesla, as a company, was at fault. Or the law itself is impossible to comply with: https://richardhanania.substack.com/p/wokeness-as-saddam-statues-the-case https://richardhanania.substack.com/p/wokeness-as-saddam-sta... >>Even after the case has been litigated, we still do not know what exactly Tesla could have done to avoid the $137 million judgment (it may be reduced on appeal). Employees did in fact get in trouble for using the n-word and drawing racist cartoons. In retrospect, they probably would’ve been safer if they just fired everyone who Diaz or Di-az accused of racism, at least the non-blacks, but there’s no guarantee that would’ve worked either, as they were in an industry that required them to rely on workers who hadn’t yet internalized elite ways of thinking about race. If they had fired black people for using the n-word too, would that have helped or hurt them in trying to avoid a lawsuit? It’s difficult to say, and that’s sort of the point. >>For next time, there’s little Tesla can do but go all in on diversity training, be as enthusiastic as possible in adopting whatever next race fad comes out of academia, and hope that the next jury isn’t as woke as the one they got this time. Until anti-discrimination laws are rolled back, or come to be based on clear and objective standards, there is no other way.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- _8j50 4y ago
  Yet, none of the other electric car makers face this. Ford employs a lot of black and white people in michigan but you don't see this there.
  - ETH_start 4y ago
    Could be a function of anti-discrimination lawyers focusing on the most high profile, deep pocketed carmaker. But as it happens, Ford, along with probably every one large American company, has been targeted numerous times by discrimination lawsuits: https://www.google.com/search?q=ford+discrimination+lawsuit&oq=ford+lawsuit+discri https://www.google.com/search?q=ford+discrimination+lawsuit&...
natch 4y ago
It’s simplistic to just trust the justice system in this case. Since short sellers pushing false narratives have drummed up a lot of hate, Tesla sometimes has to “take the hit” as Elon put it. Judges and juries have the power, not lawyers. And they are not perfect and neutral, even though in a naively idealistic notion they are supposed to be. Also your points were well answered by a different commenter but instead of discussing the good, interesting points, someone just downvoted. This is how it goes with Tesla. It’s some kind of weird thing that happens with companies that make products perceived as luxury, I guess, but in this case aided by short seller media campaigns.
- _8j50 4y ago
  You think the justice system is stacked against Tesla? The US justice system?
- HWR_14 4y ago
  > short sellers pushing false narratives have drummed up a lot of hate I haven't really seen evidence of false narratives. They definately push negative news. > Tesla sometimes has to “take the hit” as Elon put it. Wait, you dismiss what short sellers say because of economic incentives but don't consider that Elon Musk could be putting out a false narrative? Because his entire personal net worth wouldn't collapse to zero if Tesla tanks? At any rate, a jury trial is as good as you can get to determine truth. After all, highly paid people on both sides present as powerful an argument as they can to twelve disinterested people. How better to figure out what's true?

ETH_start 4y ago

>>If Tesla is losing court cases — which they are — then that’s because the judge and jury believe based on the evidence presented and argued that Tesla, as a company, was at fault. Or the law itself is impossible to comply with: https://richardhanania.substack.com/p/wokeness-as-saddam-statues-the-case https://richardhanania.substack.com/p/wokeness-as-saddam-sta... >>Even after the case has been litigated, we still do not know what exactly Tesla could have done to avoid the $137 million judgment (it may be reduced on appeal). Employees did in fact get in trouble for using the n-word and drawing racist cartoons. In retrospect, they probably would’ve been safer if they just fired everyone who Diaz or Di-az accused of racism, at least the non-blacks, but there’s no guarantee that would’ve worked either, as they were in an industry that required them to rely on workers who hadn’t yet internalized elite ways of thinking about race. If they had fired black people for using the n-word too, would that have helped or hurt them in trying to avoid a lawsuit? It’s difficult to say, and that’s sort of the point. >>For next time, there’s little Tesla can do but go all in on diversity training, be as enthusiastic as possible in adopting whatever next race fad comes out of academia, and hope that the next jury isn’t as woke as the one they got this time. Until anti-discrimination laws are rolled back, or come to be based on clear and objective standards, there is no other way.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
_8j50 4y ago
Yet, none of the other electric car makers face this. Ford employs a lot of black and white people in michigan but you don't see this there.
- ETH_start 4y ago
  Could be a function of anti-discrimination lawyers focusing on the most high profile, deep pocketed carmaker. But as it happens, Ford, along with probably every one large American company, has been targeted numerous times by discrimination lawsuits: https://www.google.com/search?q=ford+discrimination+lawsuit&oq=ford+lawsuit+discri https://www.google.com/search?q=ford+discrimination+lawsuit&...

natch 4y ago

It’s simplistic to just trust the justice system in this case. Since short sellers pushing false narratives have drummed up a lot of hate, Tesla sometimes has to “take the hit” as Elon put it. Judges and juries have the power, not lawyers. And they are not perfect and neutral, even though in a naively idealistic notion they are supposed to be. Also your points were well answered by a different commenter but instead of discussing the good, interesting points, someone just downvoted. This is how it goes with Tesla. It’s some kind of weird thing that happens with companies that make products perceived as luxury, I guess, but in this case aided by short seller media campaigns.

_8j50 4y ago
You think the justice system is stacked against Tesla? The US justice system?
HWR_14 4y ago
> short sellers pushing false narratives have drummed up a lot of hate I haven't really seen evidence of false narratives. They definately push negative news. > Tesla sometimes has to “take the hit” as Elon put it. Wait, you dismiss what short sellers say because of economic incentives but don't consider that Elon Musk could be putting out a false narrative? Because his entire personal net worth wouldn't collapse to zero if Tesla tanks? At any rate, a jury trial is as good as you can get to determine truth. After all, highly paid people on both sides present as powerful an argument as they can to twelve disinterested people. How better to figure out what's true?