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My point is that if you want to create a proper server you do the heavy lifting on server, not on client. The second you let the client decide who does what (lo

My point is that if you want to create a proper server you do the heavy lifting on server, not on client. The second you let the client decide who does what (location / damage / item drop etc etc) you get cheaters that will modify their client to bid their rule. Hence why I consider FromSoftware servers childish.

Trasmatta 4y ago
> Hence why I consider FromSoftware servers childish. Servers in FromSoft games are only for matchmaking. The actual gameplay has always been peer to peer. The design of the games mean that making the multiplayer entirely online server based would not work. They're peer to peer because that's the best way to support the hybrid singleplayer / multiplayer design where players drop into and out of your world. Otherwise your world state would need to be consistently synced to the server, which introduces major problems -- in particular, the fact that you would be dealing with lag in a game that you spend mostly singleplayer. They would have to rework the game design to be able to effectively make the multiplayer run on dedicated servers instead of P2P.
- meheleventyone 4y ago
  > Servers in FromSoft games are only for matchmaking. The actual gameplay has always been peer to peer. The design of the games mean that making the multiplayer entirely online server based would not work. They're peer to peer because that's the best way to support the hybrid singleplayer / multiplayer design where players drop into and out of your world. Otherwise your world state would need to be consistently synced to the server, which introduces major problems -- in particular, the fact that you would be dealing with lag in a game that you spend mostly singleplayer. This isn't quite true, they could have on-demand spin up of a "server" and hand off relevant gameplay decisions to it but it would be a ludicrous overcomplication and expensive for one small part of the actual game. Switching to a rollback system for their peer-peer networking would do a lot to prevent exploits though but would likely be a significant and difficult change with the determinism requirements.
fartsucker69 4y ago
genuinely lmao. you're not saying anything fromsoft devs aren't aware of. for the amounts of players they have, running typical authorative multiplayer servers that guarantee available spots for every player is an expensive undertaking, both in development time for all the backend stuff, as well as the actual running of the servers. it's a business decision made by real grown up adults. you're being horribly childish yourself.

Trasmatta 4y ago

> Hence why I consider FromSoftware servers childish. Servers in FromSoft games are only for matchmaking. The actual gameplay has always been peer to peer. The design of the games mean that making the multiplayer entirely online server based would not work. They're peer to peer because that's the best way to support the hybrid singleplayer / multiplayer design where players drop into and out of your world. Otherwise your world state would need to be consistently synced to the server, which introduces major problems -- in particular, the fact that you would be dealing with lag in a game that you spend mostly singleplayer. They would have to rework the game design to be able to effectively make the multiplayer run on dedicated servers instead of P2P.

meheleventyone 4y ago
> Servers in FromSoft games are only for matchmaking. The actual gameplay has always been peer to peer. The design of the games mean that making the multiplayer entirely online server based would not work. They're peer to peer because that's the best way to support the hybrid singleplayer / multiplayer design where players drop into and out of your world. Otherwise your world state would need to be consistently synced to the server, which introduces major problems -- in particular, the fact that you would be dealing with lag in a game that you spend mostly singleplayer. This isn't quite true, they could have on-demand spin up of a "server" and hand off relevant gameplay decisions to it but it would be a ludicrous overcomplication and expensive for one small part of the actual game. Switching to a rollback system for their peer-peer networking would do a lot to prevent exploits though but would likely be a significant and difficult change with the determinism requirements.

fartsucker69 4y ago

genuinely lmao. you're not saying anything fromsoft devs aren't aware of. for the amounts of players they have, running typical authorative multiplayer servers that guarantee available spots for every player is an expensive undertaking, both in development time for all the backend stuff, as well as the actual running of the servers. it's a business decision made by real grown up adults. you're being horribly childish yourself.