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Adobe official confirms Flash for the iPhone, says Apple will decide when

25 points by mariorz 18y ago

cpr 18y ago
There is no news here. All it says is that they've ported it to the iPhone hardware (not just the simulator, as they announced in June). And Apple has promised them nothing. This prompted me to write an email to Steve Jobs (sjobs@apple.com--he apparently actually reads all his email) as a nearly 20-year Mac (and now iPhone) ISV, begging him to stand firm and refuse to allow any kind of Flash technology on the phone. Flash flies in the face of all open Internet standards, and is a huge resource hog. Flash is Adobe's ploy to build an alternative OS that makes Windows and Mac OS irrelevant. Why should Apple give Adobe any ground on which to stand? Also see http://counternotions.com/2008/06/17/flash-iphone/ http://counternotions.com/2008/06/17/flash-iphone/ .
- axod 18y ago
  I agree. If flash came to the iPhone I'd certainly want it "opt-in". Personally I'd rather not have any flash at all... anywhere.
- neovive 18y ago
  Couldn't Adobe just make the Flash runtime available as a free download from the App Store in the interim. Maybe even an AIR-like runtime -- scaled down for performance. Obviously, Adobe would like full integration with the browser, but a downloadable runtime could at least be available for those who develop Flash content.
  - tlrobinson 18y ago
    Non-Apple-approved runtimes like Java, Flash, Silverlight aren't allowed on the App Store.
  - wmf 18y ago
    Apple prohibits iPhone apps that can download code. Perhaps Adobe could provide a Flash Player "library" that app developers could "link" into their Flash apps. I wonder how successful such apps would be, given that they wouldn't support multi-touch and probably wouldn't follow iPhone UI guidelines.
- ohhmaagawd 18y ago
  ya, i prefer all my videos to be in javascript
  - orib 18y ago
    I think you meant it sarcastically, but it's on the way, and I actually agree with you strongly. Heck you don't even need Javascript -- HTML5 is supported by Webkit.
    - whacked_new 18y ago
      Not a JS guru, but is streaming media over JS on its way? Sockets? Somehow I think RIA in these categories have been dominated by big fat Flash (or Java maybe), and it doesn't seem like it's going to budge.
- whacked_new 18y ago
  Obviously, Flash on iPhone is in Adobe's interests, and against Apple's interests. But in terms of consumer interests, is it such a bad thing? There are three posts in favor of Flash on the iPhone here and as of this posting, they have all been downmodded to -1. Assuming they are legit opinions, I don't understand the Flash hate. In the face of standards, fine. But knowing that the consumer doesn't care about standards, the ability for a Flash application to appear consistent across platforms, which is plain drudgery in HTML now (and given IE6's prevalence, will last for a good while, like it or not), I can see downsides, but it doesn't look overwhelmingly bad. Or, would you explain the principle argument against it, aside of the standards bit?
  - mpk 18y ago
    > Or, would you explain the principle argument against it, aside of the standards bit? Flash is a proprietary runtime. That means Adobe has to support whatever platform you're running at the moment. Flash support for linux has only recently become somewhat decent. And that's IA32 - if you're running a 64-bit OS on your 64-bit processor, you have to use the IA32 compatibility libraries to run flash. If, for whatever reason, you decide to go with NetBSD/SPARC64 - you don't have flash. You do, of course, have all the open web technologies because you simply recompile them for your platform. Flash is proprietary and tying yourself to that runtime will restrict not only your choices, but also the direction the web takes. The exact same holds true for Silverlight. I left out standards and their long-term development, because you specifically requested it, but that's also a major factor.
    - briansmith 18y ago
      What is the alternative? AFAICT, Flash has no real competition.
      - wmf 18y ago
        I think in open Web land the alternative is to just not write the app.
      - cpr 18y ago
- wensing 18y ago
  Speaking pragmatically, what should people be using for interactive visuals on the web? I used Flash to create Stormpulse.com ... and I can't help but notice that I've never seen a complex GMaps application run fast.
- cpr 18y ago
  Also see Gruber's take-- http://daringfireball.net/2008/09/adobe_speaks_of_flash_player_for_iphone http://daringfireball.net/2008/09/adobe_speaks_of_flash_play... -- which nails it.
callmeed 18y ago
This is great ... since one of my main businesses is providing Flash-based sites, this is welcome news (if it performs well).
noor420 18y ago
This is good news from Adobe.
thehigherlife 18y ago
i'm curious as to how they would implement this, especially considering it isn't like you can just write a plug-in for mobile safari. any one got any ideas?
- natrius 18y ago
  That is why they need Apple's blessing. They can still get the player itself working as a standalone app so when Apple says it's okay, they can integrate it with Mobile Safari and roll it out.
scumola 18y ago
Ok, http://mediawombat.com http://mediawombat.com (Flash Search Engine) is officially developing an iPhone Flash Search app now.
emmett 18y ago
All you really need is an RTMP client for Safari so that it can play flash video and all the complaints would be moot. Hm...that's a pretty good idea, actually. I wonder how hard it would be.

25 points by mariorz 18y ago

cpr 18y ago

There is no news here. All it says is that they've ported it to the iPhone hardware (not just the simulator, as they announced in June). And Apple has promised them nothing. This prompted me to write an email to Steve Jobs (sjobs@apple.com--he apparently actually reads all his email) as a nearly 20-year Mac (and now iPhone) ISV, begging him to stand firm and refuse to allow any kind of Flash technology on the phone. Flash flies in the face of all open Internet standards, and is a huge resource hog. Flash is Adobe's ploy to build an alternative OS that makes Windows and Mac OS irrelevant. Why should Apple give Adobe any ground on which to stand? Also see http://counternotions.com/2008/06/17/flash-iphone/ http://counternotions.com/2008/06/17/flash-iphone/ .

axod 18y ago
I agree. If flash came to the iPhone I'd certainly want it "opt-in". Personally I'd rather not have any flash at all... anywhere.
neovive 18y ago
Couldn't Adobe just make the Flash runtime available as a free download from the App Store in the interim. Maybe even an AIR-like runtime -- scaled down for performance. Obviously, Adobe would like full integration with the browser, but a downloadable runtime could at least be available for those who develop Flash content.
- tlrobinson 18y ago
  Non-Apple-approved runtimes like Java, Flash, Silverlight aren't allowed on the App Store.
- wmf 18y ago
  Apple prohibits iPhone apps that can download code. Perhaps Adobe could provide a Flash Player "library" that app developers could "link" into their Flash apps. I wonder how successful such apps would be, given that they wouldn't support multi-touch and probably wouldn't follow iPhone UI guidelines.
ohhmaagawd 18y ago
ya, i prefer all my videos to be in javascript
- orib 18y ago
  I think you meant it sarcastically, but it's on the way, and I actually agree with you strongly. Heck you don't even need Javascript -- HTML5 is supported by Webkit.
  - whacked_new 18y ago
    Not a JS guru, but is streaming media over JS on its way? Sockets? Somehow I think RIA in these categories have been dominated by big fat Flash (or Java maybe), and it doesn't seem like it's going to budge.
whacked_new 18y ago
Obviously, Flash on iPhone is in Adobe's interests, and against Apple's interests. But in terms of consumer interests, is it such a bad thing? There are three posts in favor of Flash on the iPhone here and as of this posting, they have all been downmodded to -1. Assuming they are legit opinions, I don't understand the Flash hate. In the face of standards, fine. But knowing that the consumer doesn't care about standards, the ability for a Flash application to appear consistent across platforms, which is plain drudgery in HTML now (and given IE6's prevalence, will last for a good while, like it or not), I can see downsides, but it doesn't look overwhelmingly bad. Or, would you explain the principle argument against it, aside of the standards bit?
- mpk 18y ago
  > Or, would you explain the principle argument against it, aside of the standards bit? Flash is a proprietary runtime. That means Adobe has to support whatever platform you're running at the moment. Flash support for linux has only recently become somewhat decent. And that's IA32 - if you're running a 64-bit OS on your 64-bit processor, you have to use the IA32 compatibility libraries to run flash. If, for whatever reason, you decide to go with NetBSD/SPARC64 - you don't have flash. You do, of course, have all the open web technologies because you simply recompile them for your platform. Flash is proprietary and tying yourself to that runtime will restrict not only your choices, but also the direction the web takes. The exact same holds true for Silverlight. I left out standards and their long-term development, because you specifically requested it, but that's also a major factor.
  - briansmith 18y ago
    What is the alternative? AFAICT, Flash has no real competition.
    - wmf 18y ago
      I think in open Web land the alternative is to just not write the app.
    - cpr 18y ago
wensing 18y ago
Speaking pragmatically, what should people be using for interactive visuals on the web? I used Flash to create Stormpulse.com ... and I can't help but notice that I've never seen a complex GMaps application run fast.
cpr 18y ago
Also see Gruber's take-- http://daringfireball.net/2008/09/adobe_speaks_of_flash_player_for_iphone http://daringfireball.net/2008/09/adobe_speaks_of_flash_play... -- which nails it.

callmeed 18y ago

This is great ... since one of my main businesses is providing Flash-based sites, this is welcome news (if it performs well).

noor420 18y ago

This is good news from Adobe.

thehigherlife 18y ago

i'm curious as to how they would implement this, especially considering it isn't like you can just write a plug-in for mobile safari. any one got any ideas?

natrius 18y ago
That is why they need Apple's blessing. They can still get the player itself working as a standalone app so when Apple says it's okay, they can integrate it with Mobile Safari and roll it out.

scumola 18y ago

Ok, http://mediawombat.com http://mediawombat.com (Flash Search Engine) is officially developing an iPhone Flash Search app now.

emmett 18y ago

All you really need is an RTMP client for Safari so that it can play flash video and all the complaints would be moot. Hm...that's a pretty good idea, actually. I wonder how hard it would be.