5 ms·

I always got very amused when i got these letters... the stuff they claimed my IP had downloaded, was definitely not downloaded on my network. rotating IP addr

I always got very amused when i got these letters... the stuff they claimed my IP had downloaded, was definitely not downloaded on my network. rotating IP addresses made the warnings pointless.

cute_boi 4y ago
Can't they use DHCP leases? Thankfully, ISP doesn't show that much effort.
- silisili 4y ago
  Even if they weren't too lazy to, an IP doesn't and can't identify a person or even household. Must be my neighbors downloading movies on my open wifi network, I can't figure out these high tech router thingymajigs ;).
  - elcomet 4y ago
    In France it's an offence to not configure securely your network if there's some illegal stuff happening on it. You are held responsible for any downloads on your own network.
    - RHSeeger 4y ago
      If that's the case, then it should be illegal for companies to sell devices that have issues that can be exploited in them.
      - silisili 4y ago
        Right? Seems like half of consumer routers have or have had an open exploit. I believe the GP, but can't see it being enforced.
    - mod 4y ago
      That must be tough on the ISPs.
      - autoexec 4y ago
        It's how it works for US ISPs already, at least as far as copyright is concerned. If an ISP doesn't uphold the DMCA, and they allow repeat offenders on their networks (defined as "unproved accusations by the media industry that an IP was logged more than once") the ISP can become liable for the actions of their subscribers and subject to billions in fines. See Cox cable and the dozen or so other lawsuits against ISPs going on right now
      - elcomet 4y ago
        ISPs are not held responsible
    - richrichardsson 4y ago
      How securely must it be secured? If you put a trivially guessable password are you still liable? Are there still exploits for wireless encryption? Kind of crazy that there isn't a huge burden of proof required by the accuser.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - hombre_fatal 4y ago
    Well, your ISP knows which customer account it routed to at a given moment in time. The rest doesn't necessarily matter to them. For example, I asked what happens if you ignore Comcast's Bittorrent warning and someone else on HN said they do indeed terminate your account. Maybe playing dumb doesn't get you off the hook. Or it reveals you as a dumb helpless open relay. The most I can imagine Comcast doing if you responded to them would be sending over a technician to reset your router password.
    - teaearlgraycold 4y ago
      The number one rule is don’t respond to the email
    - bruce511 4y ago
      >> For example, I asked what happens if you ignore Comcast's Bittorrent warning and someone else on HN said they do indeed terminate your account. Wait, what?? If I want to cancel comcast I should just install bittorrent , and I don't have to negotiate the hassle of cancelling over the phone?
      - londons_explore 4y ago
        And you don't have to pay the early termination fee either... Sometimes the fee can be the remaining service fee - so for a $150/month 24 month plan that's a whopping $3600!
  - depressedpanda 4y ago
    For many years I ran my local WiFi "secured" by WEP for this reason. Then I'd have plausible deniability since it's so ridiculously easy to crack.
whimsicalism 4y ago
> rotating IP addresses made the warnings pointless. Your ISP knows which IP you have and when.
- raincom 4y ago
  I know of an ISP in CO, which has a massive splunk ingestion of all stuff that it’s customers browsing history.
- throwaway5371 4y ago
  most ISPs dont, having many dhcp servers and not having developers is not completely trivial to parse the logs and put in some database, or just add some tooling to isc-dhcpd RIPE makes it basically mandatory to use dhcp in order to recive ip space, even though in most places it is completely useless since 2010, you save maybe 5% because literally nobody turns off their routers also of course because there is no ip space now, admins put small lease times like 1 hour, or sometimes even less, so you have constant influx of logs and updates i can imagine those scripts are buggy, misread timestamps and etc
  - whimsicalism 4y ago
    Maybe most ISPs, but most people are covered by ISPs that definitely have a way of identifying the account holder given the date and the IP address. This is for all sorts of legal requests they might get.
- hansel_der 4y ago
  in theory, yes. in practice it maybe a good thing that mistakes are made

I always got very amused when i got these letters... the stuff they claimed my IP had downloaded, was definitely not downloaded on my network. rotating IP addresses made the warnings pointless.

cute_boi 4y ago

Can't they use DHCP leases? Thankfully, ISP doesn't show that much effort.

silisili 4y ago
Even if they weren't too lazy to, an IP doesn't and can't identify a person or even household. Must be my neighbors downloading movies on my open wifi network, I can't figure out these high tech router thingymajigs ;).
- elcomet 4y ago
  In France it's an offence to not configure securely your network if there's some illegal stuff happening on it. You are held responsible for any downloads on your own network.
  - RHSeeger 4y ago
    If that's the case, then it should be illegal for companies to sell devices that have issues that can be exploited in them.
    - silisili 4y ago
      Right? Seems like half of consumer routers have or have had an open exploit. I believe the GP, but can't see it being enforced.
  - mod 4y ago
    That must be tough on the ISPs.
    - autoexec 4y ago
      It's how it works for US ISPs already, at least as far as copyright is concerned. If an ISP doesn't uphold the DMCA, and they allow repeat offenders on their networks (defined as "unproved accusations by the media industry that an IP was logged more than once") the ISP can become liable for the actions of their subscribers and subject to billions in fines. See Cox cable and the dozen or so other lawsuits against ISPs going on right now
    - elcomet 4y ago
      ISPs are not held responsible
  - richrichardsson 4y ago
    How securely must it be secured? If you put a trivially guessable password are you still liable? Are there still exploits for wireless encryption? Kind of crazy that there isn't a huge burden of proof required by the accuser.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- hombre_fatal 4y ago
  Well, your ISP knows which customer account it routed to at a given moment in time. The rest doesn't necessarily matter to them. For example, I asked what happens if you ignore Comcast's Bittorrent warning and someone else on HN said they do indeed terminate your account. Maybe playing dumb doesn't get you off the hook. Or it reveals you as a dumb helpless open relay. The most I can imagine Comcast doing if you responded to them would be sending over a technician to reset your router password.
  - teaearlgraycold 4y ago
    The number one rule is don’t respond to the email
  - bruce511 4y ago
    >> For example, I asked what happens if you ignore Comcast's Bittorrent warning and someone else on HN said they do indeed terminate your account. Wait, what?? If I want to cancel comcast I should just install bittorrent , and I don't have to negotiate the hassle of cancelling over the phone?
    - londons_explore 4y ago
      And you don't have to pay the early termination fee either... Sometimes the fee can be the remaining service fee - so for a $150/month 24 month plan that's a whopping $3600!
- depressedpanda 4y ago
  For many years I ran my local WiFi "secured" by WEP for this reason. Then I'd have plausible deniability since it's so ridiculously easy to crack.

whimsicalism 4y ago

> rotating IP addresses made the warnings pointless. Your ISP knows which IP you have and when.

raincom 4y ago
I know of an ISP in CO, which has a massive splunk ingestion of all stuff that it’s customers browsing history.
throwaway5371 4y ago
most ISPs dont, having many dhcp servers and not having developers is not completely trivial to parse the logs and put in some database, or just add some tooling to isc-dhcpd RIPE makes it basically mandatory to use dhcp in order to recive ip space, even though in most places it is completely useless since 2010, you save maybe 5% because literally nobody turns off their routers also of course because there is no ip space now, admins put small lease times like 1 hour, or sometimes even less, so you have constant influx of logs and updates i can imagine those scripts are buggy, misread timestamps and etc
- whimsicalism 4y ago
  Maybe most ISPs, but most people are covered by ISPs that definitely have a way of identifying the account holder given the date and the IP address. This is for all sorts of legal requests they might get.
hansel_der 4y ago
in theory, yes. in practice it maybe a good thing that mistakes are made