5 ms·

How does this work well? Aren’t the good people the first to leave if you decide to make everyone miserable?

by synu 4y ago

blantonl 4y ago
the good people are the ones that perform well in the kitchen when it gets hot.
- joshstrange 4y ago
  Lol. Bullshit. The good ones know to get out when a company treats it's employees like shit. Just because they aren't the target today doesn't mean they won't be the target tomorrow. The idea that people should wear bad working conditions as a badge of honor is just silly and something I'd expect people (the good ones) to grow out of after a few years max in the industry.
  - blantonl 4y ago
    you know, there are economic times where it's tough to find a job in certain industries, no matter how awesome you are.
    - joshstrange 4y ago
      Just so I'm clear, your response to "good workers don't put up with that shit" is essentially "they will if they can't find a different/better job"? Cause that just sounds exploitative and scummy. I'm sure companies make those calculations but it doesn't make it right/moral. In a vacuum I can understand and empathise with your comment but as part of this chain (where you say "the good people are the ones that perform well in the kitchen when it gets hot.") I can't take it seriously. Which is it? Do the good people perform well (and enjoy) when it gets hot or are they held hostage by the economic times?
      - blantonl 4y ago
        It's probably a combination of both. After all, the answer to an equation typically has two or more values associated with it.
- pfortuny 4y ago
  Never underestimate the power of a bored bureaucrat under pressure to keep his job.
- Dudeman112 4y ago
  The good people are the ones who don't have to stay in a hot kitchen if they don't want to I wonder... will the people who hired deadwood get shafted, or will they consider how to improve their hiring process? (ha. ha. ha.)
- A4ET8a8uTh0 4y ago
  They might.. for a little while, but eventually most people will just say 'meh' and head for greener pastures. A lot depends on the relationships and once the first link breaks, odds are, more people will follow the first 'defector'. It is really not that complicated. Few will put up with 'heat' if it gets to an annoying level; especially if they have other options.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- elteto 4y ago
  Lol no. They go find nicer, cooler kitchens.
daok 4y ago
Yes, good people that know they can find something else will leave first. Those who stay are mostly very comfortable and well positioned that they know they far in the queue of layoff or those that know they cannot find something similarly well paid.
aetherson 4y ago
It turns out that "increase expectations of delivery" is not synonymous with "make everyone miserable."
- synu 4y ago
  That’s true, but at a company that size when the order comes all the way from the top to “turn up the heat?” Sounds like a recipe for misery generation.
  - aetherson 4y ago
    Where should the order come from? I'm agnostic about whether or not Facebook will implement this well. Certainly it's possible to implement these kinds of initiatives badly. But the whole HN attitude of "how dare you?!?" doesn't strike me as people who are taking an appropriately realistic view of the real problems in trying to make a large organization be high performing, it strikes me as entitlement. I also feel like Zuckerberg has had a fairly large amount of success building a highly performant organization in the past, and while that doesn't mean he hasn't lost touch or that FB hasn't gotten too big to do the same things with or whatever, this certainty that you see in these comment threads that he's just like tripping on his shoelaces and doing self-evidently idiotic things seems extremely overconfident.
    - synu 4y ago
      I think that building a high performance organisation starts way before you get to the point where you need an emergency leadership directive at the beginning of a downturn that from now on you’re going to turn up the heat and hold people accountable for performance. If you are pulling that lever to some extent I think you have to admit you took a wrong turn somewhere.
      - aetherson 4y ago
        I dunno, maybe there was a wrong turn -- or maybe just you're responding to rapidly changing conditions. But if there was a wrong turn, and now you're error correcting, that still seems quite a bit different from, "Lol what does this doofus know, he's just an idiot."

How does this work well? Aren’t the good people the first to leave if you decide to make everyone miserable?

by synu 4y ago

How does this work well? Aren’t the good people the first to leave if you decide to make everyone miserable?

blantonl 4y ago

the good people are the ones that perform well in the kitchen when it gets hot.

joshstrange 4y ago
Lol. Bullshit. The good ones know to get out when a company treats it's employees like shit. Just because they aren't the target today doesn't mean they won't be the target tomorrow. The idea that people should wear bad working conditions as a badge of honor is just silly and something I'd expect people (the good ones) to grow out of after a few years max in the industry.
- blantonl 4y ago
  you know, there are economic times where it's tough to find a job in certain industries, no matter how awesome you are.
  - joshstrange 4y ago
    Just so I'm clear, your response to "good workers don't put up with that shit" is essentially "they will if they can't find a different/better job"? Cause that just sounds exploitative and scummy. I'm sure companies make those calculations but it doesn't make it right/moral. In a vacuum I can understand and empathise with your comment but as part of this chain (where you say "the good people are the ones that perform well in the kitchen when it gets hot.") I can't take it seriously. Which is it? Do the good people perform well (and enjoy) when it gets hot or are they held hostage by the economic times?
    - blantonl 4y ago
      It's probably a combination of both. After all, the answer to an equation typically has two or more values associated with it.
pfortuny 4y ago
Never underestimate the power of a bored bureaucrat under pressure to keep his job.
Dudeman112 4y ago
The good people are the ones who don't have to stay in a hot kitchen if they don't want to I wonder... will the people who hired deadwood get shafted, or will they consider how to improve their hiring process? (ha. ha. ha.)
A4ET8a8uTh0 4y ago
They might.. for a little while, but eventually most people will just say 'meh' and head for greener pastures. A lot depends on the relationships and once the first link breaks, odds are, more people will follow the first 'defector'. It is really not that complicated. Few will put up with 'heat' if it gets to an annoying level; especially if they have other options.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
elteto 4y ago
Lol no. They go find nicer, cooler kitchens.

daok 4y ago

Yes, good people that know they can find something else will leave first. Those who stay are mostly very comfortable and well positioned that they know they far in the queue of layoff or those that know they cannot find something similarly well paid.

aetherson 4y ago

It turns out that "increase expectations of delivery" is not synonymous with "make everyone miserable."

synu 4y ago
That’s true, but at a company that size when the order comes all the way from the top to “turn up the heat?” Sounds like a recipe for misery generation.
- aetherson 4y ago
  Where should the order come from? I'm agnostic about whether or not Facebook will implement this well. Certainly it's possible to implement these kinds of initiatives badly. But the whole HN attitude of "how dare you?!?" doesn't strike me as people who are taking an appropriately realistic view of the real problems in trying to make a large organization be high performing, it strikes me as entitlement. I also feel like Zuckerberg has had a fairly large amount of success building a highly performant organization in the past, and while that doesn't mean he hasn't lost touch or that FB hasn't gotten too big to do the same things with or whatever, this certainty that you see in these comment threads that he's just like tripping on his shoelaces and doing self-evidently idiotic things seems extremely overconfident.
  - synu 4y ago
    I think that building a high performance organisation starts way before you get to the point where you need an emergency leadership directive at the beginning of a downturn that from now on you’re going to turn up the heat and hold people accountable for performance. If you are pulling that lever to some extent I think you have to admit you took a wrong turn somewhere.
    - aetherson 4y ago
      I dunno, maybe there was a wrong turn -- or maybe just you're responding to rapidly changing conditions. But if there was a wrong turn, and now you're error correcting, that still seems quite a bit different from, "Lol what does this doofus know, he's just an idiot."