4 ms·

tbh, 16k jobs in these overvalued industries isn't much. We are adding hundreds of thousands of jobs in real industries every month. Places that make things tha

tbh, 16k jobs in these overvalued industries isn't much. We are adding hundreds of thousands of jobs in real industries every month. Places that make things that people want. Tesla is kind of the exception to this but aren't there always layoffs there? seems par for the course.

dhzhzjsbevs 4y ago
> in real industries riplol
- themitigating 4y ago
  It's amazing how for some people hatred of the political opposite causes glee when tech companies fail and people lose their jobs. People who may not be political and who probably need their job. All of this being done on internet forums and social media produced and managed by those same people.
  - dhzhzjsbevs 4y ago
    I don't blame em. Tech has always thought of itself as a bunch of snowflakes. Reality is, yes, it's a new industry, but no, it's not special. Every other industry I've been exposed to has all the same bullshit office politics. The same supposed "in jokes" that only "their industry" would understand.
- mtoner23 4y ago
  The world will get by if we have fewer coinbases, SaaS companies and other tech jobs. If we have fewer factories, oil refineries, meat packing plants; there will be shortages and riots.
  - fatjokes 4y ago
    I mean, hopefully some of those tech jobs are making those oil refineries, factories, meat packing plants more efficient.
    - pessimizer 4y ago
      Then they're in a "real" industry. How many of them are actually doing that?
      - steve_adams_86 4y ago
        I was recently interviewing for a lot of jobs (20 or more) and most of them were in “real” industries. Making factories more efficient, improving logistics, tools for various laboratory facilities to work more consistently and efficiently, etc. Around 75% of what I encountered touched real products, workers, and production directly. It seems like there is plenty of that kind of tech out there and in development right now. The other 4 or 5 companies were strictly internet related, selling digital products to people doing things on computers. I’m not sure if I encountered that because that’s a reasonable representation of what’s out there right now. I do know I prefer work where I get to support real people doing real things, so to speak. In any case, there are definitely roles like this out there and plenty of companies hiring.
igobyterry 4y ago
I'm in agreement with you. I know the people who were laid off were passionate about what they were working on - and this was a big disruption to their life. But when I see some of these layoffs, my immediate thought is: 1.) Who is this company and how did they have so many people? 2.) OK, that industry experienced a COVID boon (edtech, mortgages) 3.) Taking advantage of others laying off people to get rid of poor performers Netflix laying off employees; I'm sorry, but Netflix is mostly a catalog of garbage at an ever increasing cost, with legitimate competitors at this point.
YZF 4y ago
Right. The same site from which this is taken shows ~400k open tech positions. That ratio is pretty decent. Didn't Elon just say how Tesla's software needs more work? How is he going to do that without software engineers? Is Tesla even laying off software people or other employees? As a model 3 owner, the mobile app sucks, the in-car UI/UX which was cutting edge is now falling behind, let's not talk about auto-pilot/self-driving. They should be desperate for better software people. The one common thing about "overvalued" companies is that they either need to show strong growth or their stock is going to be decimated. Management often looks at headcount as proxy of growth (I'd argue that's not always correct but that's a different question). It's extremely dangerous for the stock price of these "overvalued" companies to do massive layoffs both in term of further hurting the short term and a big impact on the long term. If they have plenty of cash they can and should be looking forward. That said this can be a reasonable excuse to offload some lower performing employees or adjust some priorities.
- sfo_suger_daddy 4y ago
  More isn't a replacemnet for better
InitialLastName 4y ago
> Places that make things that people want. Please ignore the man behind the curtain.
themitigating 4y ago
"real industries"? What is a real industry to you? Farming done by migrant, mostly illegal workers, or machines? Manufacturing of goods that mostly happens in China?
- spaceman_2020 4y ago
  Not to be a luddite, but a ton of tech ventures now straddle the edge of value addition to society. Value might be subjective, but its hard to see how a NFT marketplace is as valuable to society as, say, a tractor factory or steel plant.
  - themitigating 4y ago
    I find those to be exceptions to most companies in our economy. Construction of housing, food, medicine, water, army/police are your base levels. An NFT marketplace is a similar to gambling or derivatives. The value is potential income for people.
    - mellavora 4y ago
      "value" is an ambiguous word. I think you understand it as "something people are willing to put money into", which certainly covers gambling. Another definition of "value" is something which increased the economic output, a positive-sum game. Thus gambling (which is zero-sum) does not create value. Derivatives do create value in the second sense, in that they can be used to protect against risk, thus creating value (or allowing the creation of value). Yes, they can also be used for the equivalent of gambling, but they have additional uses.
    - wpietri 4y ago
      Just to be clear, gambling is a net societal negative. For every dollar that goes in, less than a dollar in income comes out. It's going to happen, but let's not pretend that it's value-creating.
    - andsoitis 4y ago
      > An NFT marketplace is a similar to gambling or derivatives. Derivatives have real utility.

dhzhzjsbevs 4y ago

> in real industries riplol

themitigating 4y ago
It's amazing how for some people hatred of the political opposite causes glee when tech companies fail and people lose their jobs. People who may not be political and who probably need their job. All of this being done on internet forums and social media produced and managed by those same people.
- dhzhzjsbevs 4y ago
  I don't blame em. Tech has always thought of itself as a bunch of snowflakes. Reality is, yes, it's a new industry, but no, it's not special. Every other industry I've been exposed to has all the same bullshit office politics. The same supposed "in jokes" that only "their industry" would understand.
mtoner23 4y ago
The world will get by if we have fewer coinbases, SaaS companies and other tech jobs. If we have fewer factories, oil refineries, meat packing plants; there will be shortages and riots.
- fatjokes 4y ago
  I mean, hopefully some of those tech jobs are making those oil refineries, factories, meat packing plants more efficient.
  - pessimizer 4y ago
    Then they're in a "real" industry. How many of them are actually doing that?
    - steve_adams_86 4y ago
      I was recently interviewing for a lot of jobs (20 or more) and most of them were in “real” industries. Making factories more efficient, improving logistics, tools for various laboratory facilities to work more consistently and efficiently, etc. Around 75% of what I encountered touched real products, workers, and production directly. It seems like there is plenty of that kind of tech out there and in development right now. The other 4 or 5 companies were strictly internet related, selling digital products to people doing things on computers. I’m not sure if I encountered that because that’s a reasonable representation of what’s out there right now. I do know I prefer work where I get to support real people doing real things, so to speak. In any case, there are definitely roles like this out there and plenty of companies hiring.

igobyterry 4y ago

I'm in agreement with you. I know the people who were laid off were passionate about what they were working on - and this was a big disruption to their life. But when I see some of these layoffs, my immediate thought is: 1.) Who is this company and how did they have so many people? 2.) OK, that industry experienced a COVID boon (edtech, mortgages) 3.) Taking advantage of others laying off people to get rid of poor performers Netflix laying off employees; I'm sorry, but Netflix is mostly a catalog of garbage at an ever increasing cost, with legitimate competitors at this point.

YZF 4y ago

Right. The same site from which this is taken shows ~400k open tech positions. That ratio is pretty decent. Didn't Elon just say how Tesla's software needs more work? How is he going to do that without software engineers? Is Tesla even laying off software people or other employees? As a model 3 owner, the mobile app sucks, the in-car UI/UX which was cutting edge is now falling behind, let's not talk about auto-pilot/self-driving. They should be desperate for better software people. The one common thing about "overvalued" companies is that they either need to show strong growth or their stock is going to be decimated. Management often looks at headcount as proxy of growth (I'd argue that's not always correct but that's a different question). It's extremely dangerous for the stock price of these "overvalued" companies to do massive layoffs both in term of further hurting the short term and a big impact on the long term. If they have plenty of cash they can and should be looking forward. That said this can be a reasonable excuse to offload some lower performing employees or adjust some priorities.

sfo_suger_daddy 4y ago
More isn't a replacemnet for better

InitialLastName 4y ago

> Places that make things that people want. Please ignore the man behind the curtain.

themitigating 4y ago

"real industries"? What is a real industry to you? Farming done by migrant, mostly illegal workers, or machines? Manufacturing of goods that mostly happens in China?

spaceman_2020 4y ago
Not to be a luddite, but a ton of tech ventures now straddle the edge of value addition to society. Value might be subjective, but its hard to see how a NFT marketplace is as valuable to society as, say, a tractor factory or steel plant.
- themitigating 4y ago
  I find those to be exceptions to most companies in our economy. Construction of housing, food, medicine, water, army/police are your base levels. An NFT marketplace is a similar to gambling or derivatives. The value is potential income for people.
  - mellavora 4y ago
    "value" is an ambiguous word. I think you understand it as "something people are willing to put money into", which certainly covers gambling. Another definition of "value" is something which increased the economic output, a positive-sum game. Thus gambling (which is zero-sum) does not create value. Derivatives do create value in the second sense, in that they can be used to protect against risk, thus creating value (or allowing the creation of value). Yes, they can also be used for the equivalent of gambling, but they have additional uses.
  - wpietri 4y ago
    Just to be clear, gambling is a net societal negative. For every dollar that goes in, less than a dollar in income comes out. It's going to happen, but let's not pretend that it's value-creating.
  - andsoitis 4y ago
    > An NFT marketplace is a similar to gambling or derivatives. Derivatives have real utility.