6 ms·

On a similar note, real photographers use prime lenses. Zoom lenses are for noobs who can't relocate. You also put your prime lenses on DSLRs, mirrorless camera

On a similar note, real photographers use prime lenses. Zoom lenses are for noobs who can't relocate. You also put your prime lenses on DSLRs, mirrorless cameras are clearly ulterior. If you think smartphones are a camera, you're the reason we're behind as species. For you coffee, by the way, you grind it yourself, then you use your weiss distributor and flattener before you tamp it. If your coffee doesn't cost at least 20$ per pound and involves at least 5 manual steps, there's no way it can be good. If you put pre-ground coffee in a machine, you might as well skip these steps and drink directly from the toilet. And since we're on HN, real developers use Unix as an IDE. With vi, obviously - emacs people can quit right now. And don't even get me started on those IntelliJ script kiddies --- Seriously, there are always be people in each niche who think that their way is the only way and people who stray from the path are to feel the wrath of god [0]. I could go on and on with examples like this. Funnily enough, this quite often doesn't even work for them (I can tell from personal experience that bringing a DSLR with gear up a mountain is not pure fun, for example). Simply do what works for you and ignore them - unless you asked them or they pay you, their opinion is pretty irrelevant. [0] Although it should be mentioned that usually quite a few people just act snobby for the joke and aren't actually on a crusade. The pineaple-pizza-thingy seems to be mostly a joke, for example.

automatic6131 4y ago
>The pineaple-pizza-thingy seems to be mostly a joke, for example. Tell me you haven't visited Italy/don't know any Italians well, without telling me you haven't been to Italy.
- FooHentai 4y ago
  Something I believe is that persistent satire and sincere belief are indistinguishable in many settings, and that persistent application of satire tends to cultivate sincere belief in the same thing as the idea spreads around. Not that I think Italians look down on Hawaiian pizza as a result of satire, that's more that Italians often see a national dish that's been heavily evolved overseas in a negative light, and Hawaiian pizza is the shining example of it to be seized upon. Chicago Deep Dish being another. But online it's definitely an issue - Ironic shit-posting of dumb things eventually leads to areas chock full of people with those exact beliefs for real. That's how meme magic works. Meme something, no matter how dumb, persistently enough, and it'll enter the collective conscious as a sincerely held belief.
  - rascul 4y ago
    > Hawaiian pizza I've always found that name amusing. From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaiian_pizza https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaiian_pizza : > Sam Panopoulos, a Greek-born Canadian, created the first Hawaiian pizza at the Satellite Restaurant in Chatham, Ontario, Canada in 1962. Inspired in part by his experience preparing Chinese dishes which commonly mix sweet and savory flavours, Panopoulos experimented with adding pineapple, ham, bacon, and other toppings. These additions were not initially very popular. > The addition of pineapple to the traditional mix of tomato sauce and cheese, along with either ham or bacon, later became popular locally and eventually became a staple offering of pizzerias on a global scale. The name of this creation is, in fact, actually not directly inspired by the U.S. state of Hawaii at all; Panopoulos chose the name Hawaiian after the brand of canned pineapple they were using at the time.
    - FooHentai 4y ago
      Hah, that's great. Hawaiian pizza always made sense to me since I grew up in the UK in the eighties, where pork/gammon with canned pineapple rings was an ordinary evening meal (bear in mind, this was close to the era of Salmon Mousse, many culinary crimes were committed around that time). I guess the association between pineapple and Hawaii is in and of itself kinda odd too, since I think they're native to South America.
      - nikau 4y ago
        Hawaiian pizza was probably the most popular pizza in Australia in the 80s also. Even though I'm a bit of a pizza snob I still enjoy a Hawaiian pizza occasionally, somehow the combination of trashy shredded processed ham and pineapple just works well.
        FooHentai 4y ago
        Try sprinkling some chili flakes on top. I didn't expect it to be good but it's amazing.
    - sybercecurity 4y ago
- jfengel 4y ago
  I have been to Italy, a fair bit, and as far as I can tell their attitude is "pizza is a flatbread that you use to stretch out whatever other ingredients you have on hand". There are certainly regional traditions, and obviously pineapple isn't any of them, but I don't see why they'd object to you putting whatever the hell you want on your pizza. Caveat: I haven't been south of Rome, and I gather that there may be more pizza grumpiness further south.
  - leoedin 4y ago
    Having worked closely with Italians from all over Italy, living in London - every one of them I spoke to felt passionately about food being a specific way. Nothing would get my Italian colleagues more riled up over lunch than a British interpretation of an Italian classic dish. There's clearly a very strong traditionalist food culture in Italy.
  - jaclaz 4y ago
    JFYI: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28327893 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28327893
- rr888 4y ago
  > Tell me you haven't visited Italy/don't know any Italians well, without telling me you haven't been to Italy. Seriously who cares what Italians think, are you that neurotic? Hawaiian pizza is great.
- frosted-flakes 4y ago
  At this point American pizza isn't an Italian food, it's American/global. No one thinks "pizza" when you say, "lets's get some Italian".
  - samatman 4y ago
    In the more populous parts of America, Italian pizza is one of six or seven varieties one can find, generally (though not on the West Coast) dominated by the local take. I've had pizza margherita in Italy, and at least three large US cities: the one in Rome was better, but frankly, that's probably because I was in Rome when I ate it. It was the same sort of pizza you get from Italian pizza joints in the States.
    - jaclaz 4y ago
      Once said that not necessarily all pizza in Italy is good, when it is good it is simply another thing from "international" pizza, I believe mainly because of the ingredients used that - generally speaking - are simply not available (at the same level of freshness/taste) outside Italy and in some cases not even everywhere in Italy. A typical example is "mozzarella di bufala" that is easily available all over Italy, but if/when you taste the fresh one in the area around Caserta and Naples you will understand how it is different.
      - samatman 4y ago
        I'm sure I didn't have the best possible Italian pizza, it was good but hardly my most memorable meal in my (alas, quite brief) time in Italy. All I'm saying is that a pizza margherita at an 'Italian style pizza joint' in the States is the same recipe, wood-fired oven, buffalo mozzarella, and so on. One would need to pay extra for the bufala, but the low-moisture cheese we Americans call 'mozzarella' is never used, it would be fresh ball mozarella. Whereas a good New York slice can't be had in Italy for love nor money! (I suspect this isn't actually true; I found a Mission burrito in Guanajuato Mexico, good food has a way of getting around). Now, you can say that's like trying to find a General Tso's Chicken in Hong Kong, but I enjoy that dish as well.
- barkingcat 4y ago
  In fact Italian pizza stores love selling pineapple pizza to tourists! Whatever gets a euro from a tourist is whatever they will sell. When I was in Italy, all the pizza shops sold pineapple pizza, for a slightly higher price, cause it sells that well to North Americans.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
hef19898 4y ago
Regarding prime lenses: If you are unable to take good pictures with a zoom pense you clearly have bad technique. And the only true way if taking pictures is on film, it forces to think about composition and exposure. Unless you are into wildlife and birds, there of course anything below a pro-DSLR, or maybe, maybe a pro mirroless action body and 600 mm OEM prime lenses, on a carbon fibre tripod, is clearly not enough. On a serious note, as long as you like your pictures everything is good. If you make living selling your pics all is good as long as your clients are happy. And nobody cares about the gear used in taking a particular picture, or cooking a meal. No idea why we cannot simply enjoy common hobbies. All that are reasons I stay away from forums and social media on my hobbies. With the sole exception of a very helpfull forum on the particular brand of my classic car, I need my technical advice from somewhere.
- gigaflop 4y ago
  Something I keep in mind: The people who spend most of their time online talking about a hobby, are usually not the ones who spend most of their time doing the hobby.
  - hef19898 4y ago
    True! And those talking online about the gear used for their hobby are the worst cases of that.
    - gigaflop 4y ago
      With one potential exception being mechanical keyboard cultists. After all, the best use of a $1k keyboard is to talk hype about how great it is, and how trashy MX Browns are.
      - hef19898 4y ago
        When you sit at the center of an almost impossible ven diagram, you can do anything!
- 4y ago
cttet 4y ago
I personally really don’t care about this judgements. But an interesting thing to me is that all the claims are pointing to a category of people. I wonder why some people what to be categorised, like, even if “real programmer use vi”, why do I want to be a “real programmer” if I don’t like vi? What’s the charm of the arbitrary tag?
cykros 4y ago
Don't forget to grind that coffee in a hand crank burr grinder, so you can control every aspect of the process. And don't even THINK about using water that is even a degree away from 200F (I know someone who uses boiling water -- the monster!) While you're at it, if you're drinking tea, of course follow the RFC. Pouring the hot tea out of the pot and then adding milk is absolutely barbaric.
throwaway675309 4y ago
It cracks me up how defensive people get about what tools you use, meanwhile I'm just gonna keep building things because your audience doesn't give a crap what tools were used to make the actual end product.
- hef19898 4y ago
  This is so true. And that also defines "pro" tools, those tend to be the best money making devices, and not the technically best devices. They speed up work, maybe hold longer, or are a tad more ergonomically. Because all of that matters if tools are being used for hours every day to earn a living. In the end, it is the end product that matters. And that is influenced a lot more by the person and ingeredients / raw materials then it is by the tools being used.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
Groxx 4y ago
Purely on the coffee note: freshly grinding coffee is by far the best $-investment vs quality-improvement you can make. A $10 (or cheaper!) blade grinder makes a noticeable improvement over pre-ground for nearly everyone, and you can absolutely just stop there and enjoy the step up and that grinder will probably last as long as your drip machine. Very little after that will achieve such a large improvement, and no matter what it'll cost a lot more money and time (e.g. to find and buy better coffee beans).
cultofmetatron 4y ago
> mirrorless cameras are clearly ulterior. I'm going to assume this is satire but in case this isn't, modern mirrorless cameras are far superior to dlrs for most applications these days. my z5 does everything my previous dslr does and gives me realtime exposure preview. And don't get me started on the Z9. With that camera, the dslr's's days are numbered.

automatic6131 4y ago

>The pineaple-pizza-thingy seems to be mostly a joke, for example. Tell me you haven't visited Italy/don't know any Italians well, without telling me you haven't been to Italy.

FooHentai 4y ago
Something I believe is that persistent satire and sincere belief are indistinguishable in many settings, and that persistent application of satire tends to cultivate sincere belief in the same thing as the idea spreads around. Not that I think Italians look down on Hawaiian pizza as a result of satire, that's more that Italians often see a national dish that's been heavily evolved overseas in a negative light, and Hawaiian pizza is the shining example of it to be seized upon. Chicago Deep Dish being another. But online it's definitely an issue - Ironic shit-posting of dumb things eventually leads to areas chock full of people with those exact beliefs for real. That's how meme magic works. Meme something, no matter how dumb, persistently enough, and it'll enter the collective conscious as a sincerely held belief.
- rascul 4y ago
  > Hawaiian pizza I've always found that name amusing. From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaiian_pizza https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaiian_pizza : > Sam Panopoulos, a Greek-born Canadian, created the first Hawaiian pizza at the Satellite Restaurant in Chatham, Ontario, Canada in 1962. Inspired in part by his experience preparing Chinese dishes which commonly mix sweet and savory flavours, Panopoulos experimented with adding pineapple, ham, bacon, and other toppings. These additions were not initially very popular. > The addition of pineapple to the traditional mix of tomato sauce and cheese, along with either ham or bacon, later became popular locally and eventually became a staple offering of pizzerias on a global scale. The name of this creation is, in fact, actually not directly inspired by the U.S. state of Hawaii at all; Panopoulos chose the name Hawaiian after the brand of canned pineapple they were using at the time.
  - FooHentai 4y ago
    Hah, that's great. Hawaiian pizza always made sense to me since I grew up in the UK in the eighties, where pork/gammon with canned pineapple rings was an ordinary evening meal (bear in mind, this was close to the era of Salmon Mousse, many culinary crimes were committed around that time). I guess the association between pineapple and Hawaii is in and of itself kinda odd too, since I think they're native to South America.
    - nikau 4y ago
      Hawaiian pizza was probably the most popular pizza in Australia in the 80s also. Even though I'm a bit of a pizza snob I still enjoy a Hawaiian pizza occasionally, somehow the combination of trashy shredded processed ham and pineapple just works well.
      - FooHentai 4y ago
        Try sprinkling some chili flakes on top. I didn't expect it to be good but it's amazing.
  - sybercecurity 4y ago
jfengel 4y ago
I have been to Italy, a fair bit, and as far as I can tell their attitude is "pizza is a flatbread that you use to stretch out whatever other ingredients you have on hand". There are certainly regional traditions, and obviously pineapple isn't any of them, but I don't see why they'd object to you putting whatever the hell you want on your pizza. Caveat: I haven't been south of Rome, and I gather that there may be more pizza grumpiness further south.
- leoedin 4y ago
  Having worked closely with Italians from all over Italy, living in London - every one of them I spoke to felt passionately about food being a specific way. Nothing would get my Italian colleagues more riled up over lunch than a British interpretation of an Italian classic dish. There's clearly a very strong traditionalist food culture in Italy.
- jaclaz 4y ago
  JFYI: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28327893 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28327893
rr888 4y ago
> Tell me you haven't visited Italy/don't know any Italians well, without telling me you haven't been to Italy. Seriously who cares what Italians think, are you that neurotic? Hawaiian pizza is great.
frosted-flakes 4y ago
At this point American pizza isn't an Italian food, it's American/global. No one thinks "pizza" when you say, "lets's get some Italian".
- samatman 4y ago
  In the more populous parts of America, Italian pizza is one of six or seven varieties one can find, generally (though not on the West Coast) dominated by the local take. I've had pizza margherita in Italy, and at least three large US cities: the one in Rome was better, but frankly, that's probably because I was in Rome when I ate it. It was the same sort of pizza you get from Italian pizza joints in the States.
  - jaclaz 4y ago
    Once said that not necessarily all pizza in Italy is good, when it is good it is simply another thing from "international" pizza, I believe mainly because of the ingredients used that - generally speaking - are simply not available (at the same level of freshness/taste) outside Italy and in some cases not even everywhere in Italy. A typical example is "mozzarella di bufala" that is easily available all over Italy, but if/when you taste the fresh one in the area around Caserta and Naples you will understand how it is different.
    - samatman 4y ago
      I'm sure I didn't have the best possible Italian pizza, it was good but hardly my most memorable meal in my (alas, quite brief) time in Italy. All I'm saying is that a pizza margherita at an 'Italian style pizza joint' in the States is the same recipe, wood-fired oven, buffalo mozzarella, and so on. One would need to pay extra for the bufala, but the low-moisture cheese we Americans call 'mozzarella' is never used, it would be fresh ball mozarella. Whereas a good New York slice can't be had in Italy for love nor money! (I suspect this isn't actually true; I found a Mission burrito in Guanajuato Mexico, good food has a way of getting around). Now, you can say that's like trying to find a General Tso's Chicken in Hong Kong, but I enjoy that dish as well.
barkingcat 4y ago
In fact Italian pizza stores love selling pineapple pizza to tourists! Whatever gets a euro from a tourist is whatever they will sell. When I was in Italy, all the pizza shops sold pineapple pizza, for a slightly higher price, cause it sells that well to North Americans.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

hef19898 4y ago

Regarding prime lenses: If you are unable to take good pictures with a zoom pense you clearly have bad technique. And the only true way if taking pictures is on film, it forces to think about composition and exposure. Unless you are into wildlife and birds, there of course anything below a pro-DSLR, or maybe, maybe a pro mirroless action body and 600 mm OEM prime lenses, on a carbon fibre tripod, is clearly not enough. On a serious note, as long as you like your pictures everything is good. If you make living selling your pics all is good as long as your clients are happy. And nobody cares about the gear used in taking a particular picture, or cooking a meal. No idea why we cannot simply enjoy common hobbies. All that are reasons I stay away from forums and social media on my hobbies. With the sole exception of a very helpfull forum on the particular brand of my classic car, I need my technical advice from somewhere.

gigaflop 4y ago
Something I keep in mind: The people who spend most of their time online talking about a hobby, are usually not the ones who spend most of their time doing the hobby.
- hef19898 4y ago
  True! And those talking online about the gear used for their hobby are the worst cases of that.
  - gigaflop 4y ago
    With one potential exception being mechanical keyboard cultists. After all, the best use of a $1k keyboard is to talk hype about how great it is, and how trashy MX Browns are.
    - hef19898 4y ago
      When you sit at the center of an almost impossible ven diagram, you can do anything!
4y ago

cttet 4y ago

I personally really don’t care about this judgements. But an interesting thing to me is that all the claims are pointing to a category of people. I wonder why some people what to be categorised, like, even if “real programmer use vi”, why do I want to be a “real programmer” if I don’t like vi? What’s the charm of the arbitrary tag?

cykros 4y ago

Don't forget to grind that coffee in a hand crank burr grinder, so you can control every aspect of the process. And don't even THINK about using water that is even a degree away from 200F (I know someone who uses boiling water -- the monster!) While you're at it, if you're drinking tea, of course follow the RFC. Pouring the hot tea out of the pot and then adding milk is absolutely barbaric.

throwaway675309 4y ago

It cracks me up how defensive people get about what tools you use, meanwhile I'm just gonna keep building things because your audience doesn't give a crap what tools were used to make the actual end product.

hef19898 4y ago
This is so true. And that also defines "pro" tools, those tend to be the best money making devices, and not the technically best devices. They speed up work, maybe hold longer, or are a tad more ergonomically. Because all of that matters if tools are being used for hours every day to earn a living. In the end, it is the end product that matters. And that is influenced a lot more by the person and ingeredients / raw materials then it is by the tools being used.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

Groxx 4y ago

Purely on the coffee note: freshly grinding coffee is by far the best $-investment vs quality-improvement you can make. A $10 (or cheaper!) blade grinder makes a noticeable improvement over pre-ground for nearly everyone, and you can absolutely just stop there and enjoy the step up and that grinder will probably last as long as your drip machine. Very little after that will achieve such a large improvement, and no matter what it'll cost a lot more money and time (e.g. to find and buy better coffee beans).

cultofmetatron 4y ago

> mirrorless cameras are clearly ulterior. I'm going to assume this is satire but in case this isn't, modern mirrorless cameras are far superior to dlrs for most applications these days. my z5 does everything my previous dslr does and gives me realtime exposure preview. And don't get me started on the Z9. With that camera, the dslr's's days are numbered.