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It is not hard to think of examples where steelmanning would not be worthwhile, such as when someone thinks an entire group of people is inferior. And unfortuna

It is not hard to think of examples where steelmanning would not be worthwhile, such as when someone thinks an entire group of people is inferior. And unfortunately these types of views underly a surprisingly large number of political opinions these days.

LAC-Tech 4y ago
Again, are you afraid you might change your mind? I like to think I have a pretty good idea of why people - whose ideas I find repulsive - believe what they do. In my mind that means I have the capability to change their mind. The risk I take is that they can change mine.
- XorNot 4y ago
  Why are you up and down this thread defending a technique while refusing to ever enunciate a single position you think you understand, or have had your mind changed on? Afraid there might be some really good reasons they're not worth talking about?
  - LAC-Tech 4y ago
    Because of comments like this, basically.
    - hitekker 4y ago
      Ironically, I haven't seen steelmanning demonstrated well in this comment section. Lots of praise, specious examples. The top comment claims that a heated back-and-forth where they recommend steelmanning is a successful discussion. Hmmm. Steelmanning in practice may just be indistinguishable from trolling. The lazy redditor wants to look smarter than other redditors, by making a convoluted argument that no one believes in. It's intellectual posturing dressed up in "good faith".
    - spacemanmatt 4y ago
      You seem to have confused contrarianism with steelmanning.
icelancer 4y ago
>> such as when someone thinks an entire group of people is inferior A point of steelmanning is that your assumption that this person thinks an entire group of people is inferior might be incorrect.
- watwut 4y ago
  It feels good to be superior. And people really really like theries that make them feel superior. They also really really dislike walking away from then, catching any straws to be able to keep that feeling. Your grand plan will fail the moment you finally get to the "incorrect" part. Cause there you dealing with additional feeling of loss you yourself just caused.

LAC-Tech 4y ago

Again, are you afraid you might change your mind? I like to think I have a pretty good idea of why people - whose ideas I find repulsive - believe what they do. In my mind that means I have the capability to change their mind. The risk I take is that they can change mine.

XorNot 4y ago
Why are you up and down this thread defending a technique while refusing to ever enunciate a single position you think you understand, or have had your mind changed on? Afraid there might be some really good reasons they're not worth talking about?
- LAC-Tech 4y ago
  Because of comments like this, basically.
  - hitekker 4y ago
    Ironically, I haven't seen steelmanning demonstrated well in this comment section. Lots of praise, specious examples. The top comment claims that a heated back-and-forth where they recommend steelmanning is a successful discussion. Hmmm. Steelmanning in practice may just be indistinguishable from trolling. The lazy redditor wants to look smarter than other redditors, by making a convoluted argument that no one believes in. It's intellectual posturing dressed up in "good faith".
  - spacemanmatt 4y ago
    You seem to have confused contrarianism with steelmanning.

icelancer 4y ago

>> such as when someone thinks an entire group of people is inferior A point of steelmanning is that your assumption that this person thinks an entire group of people is inferior might be incorrect.

watwut 4y ago
It feels good to be superior. And people really really like theries that make them feel superior. They also really really dislike walking away from then, catching any straws to be able to keep that feeling. Your grand plan will fail the moment you finally get to the "incorrect" part. Cause there you dealing with additional feeling of loss you yourself just caused.