4 ms·

there's a difference between cults and culture, both tend to generate their own language

by arthyn 4y ago

lisper 4y ago
That's true, but I stand by my characterization of Urbit as a cult rather than a culture because Urbit's terminology is intentionally misleading. Urbit is deliberately obfuscated down to its very core. And the reason for this is that it is designed to produce an in-group that is separated from the out-group. The founder of Urbit, Curtus Yarvin, is an extreme hard-core right-wing liberatarian. Go read up about him: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtis_Yarvin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtis_Yarvin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Enlightenment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Enlightenment I'm not even sure that Curtis would object to my characterization of Urbit as a cult. He and I are not exactly on speaking terms any more, as you might imagine, but he is just enough of an iconoclast that he might actually agree with me on this.
- vorpalhex 4y ago
  A shibboleth (a secret language or way of speaking used for identification) isn't unique to cults. Typically the test for a cult is: 1. Secret knowledge 2. Enforced isolation 3. Some kind of leader/living authority Eg, Scientology has their secret books, they will attack you and sue you if you share that secret and they have church elders.
- jlehman 4y ago
  You've given zero justification for this assertion. Pointing to the years-absent founder's background and your personal speaking relationship with him (?), whom none of the people that worked on the content in the OP have EVER worked with, sounds like a straw man. At the very least it's lame reasoning.
  - lisper 4y ago
    > You've given zero justification for this assertion. No, that's not true. I have given some justification. You could fairly criticize my justification as inadequate, but not as entirely absent. And you're right. I would not claim to have given adequate justification for my assertion. I can't prove that Urbit is a cult. It's just my personal opinion. If you don't like it you can return it for a full refund. But I will say this: my opinion is informed by some pretty extensive knowledge of the technical parts of Urbit, especially its core design, and personal first-hand knowledge of the history and motivation behind its design. Again, I can't prove any of this. I could not publish it as a peer-reviewed paper. All I can do it wave the warning flag. How you choose to act on that is up to you.

there's a difference between cults and culture, both tend to generate their own language

by arthyn 4y ago

there's a difference between cults and culture, both tend to generate their own language

That's true, but I stand by my characterization of Urbit as a cult rather than a culture because Urbit's terminology is intentionally misleading. Urbit is deliberately obfuscated down to its very core. And the reason for this is that it is designed to produce an in-group that is separated from the out-group. The founder of Urbit, Curtus Yarvin, is an extreme hard-core right-wing liberatarian. Go read up about him: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtis_Yarvin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtis_Yarvin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Enlightenment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Enlightenment I'm not even sure that Curtis would object to my characterization of Urbit as a cult. He and I are not exactly on speaking terms any more, as you might imagine, but he is just enough of an iconoclast that he might actually agree with me on this.

vorpalhex 4y ago
A shibboleth (a secret language or way of speaking used for identification) isn't unique to cults. Typically the test for a cult is: 1. Secret knowledge 2. Enforced isolation 3. Some kind of leader/living authority Eg, Scientology has their secret books, they will attack you and sue you if you share that secret and they have church elders.
jlehman 4y ago
You've given zero justification for this assertion. Pointing to the years-absent founder's background and your personal speaking relationship with him (?), whom none of the people that worked on the content in the OP have EVER worked with, sounds like a straw man. At the very least it's lame reasoning.
- lisper 4y ago
  > You've given zero justification for this assertion. No, that's not true. I have given some justification. You could fairly criticize my justification as inadequate, but not as entirely absent. And you're right. I would not claim to have given adequate justification for my assertion. I can't prove that Urbit is a cult. It's just my personal opinion. If you don't like it you can return it for a full refund. But I will say this: my opinion is informed by some pretty extensive knowledge of the technical parts of Urbit, especially its core design, and personal first-hand knowledge of the history and motivation behind its design. Again, I can't prove any of this. I could not publish it as a peer-reviewed paper. All I can do it wave the warning flag. How you choose to act on that is up to you.