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Although it may not have made much sense to you, you seem to have captured the gist of what I tried to say. Even athiests can appreciate the Beatitudes.

netcan 18y ago
I suppose I did if the Gist of "Too many people confuse faith with the idea of absolute belief" is "Too many people assume that faith = literal belief in Genesis, Leviticus or Luke" Certainly absolute beliefs matter in a practical sense. If I were in The States, Obama's beliefs wouldn't worry me. Palin's might. In the very theoretical sense, they both worry me a little. But even Palin's beliefs are probably less likely to affect anything to the degree that her social conservatism (related but not equivalent) is likely to have.
- MHollender 18y ago
  "But even Palin's beliefs are probably less likely to affect anything to the degree that her social conservatism" Well, I'm not an American and not religious (well, Buddhist but that doesn't really count as a religion), but I fail to see what's wrong with a moderate amount of social conservativism. One of my favourite hobbies is history. And what I learned from history is that liberal periods, when everybody was running around having fun and not caring about much else, were, well, the last period before a collapse. Societies, civilizations when they still had a future before them were very conservative, regarded duty more important than fun, there was a strong focus on families, and so on . It's not something to like or dislike. It's more like a factual thing. A man might be most alive when he is having the most fun, but a society isn't. Think of the Romans, when they still had a lot of will to live, the early period when they really expanded, what virtues they had, gravitas, pietas, dignitas... wasn't very fun and not liberal at all. But they had a very strong will to live. And had a future.
bmj 18y ago
A common apologetic for Christianity is that you either believe Christ was God, or that he was a lunatic. The middle ground (that is, Christ wasn't God but merely a brilliant moral philosopher) is hard to defend given what the Bible says Christ did and said.
- tptacek 18y ago
  It's not a "middle ground" to suggest that the core beliefs of a religion are false. I'm not saying you have to accept Christianity or Buddhism or Zoroastrianism, but you might be a bit more self-aware.
  - netcan 18y ago
    "Middle ground" is just not a great way of looking at things. It's nice to be able to put things on a scale of Jesus was a nice guy--->The bible contains divine guidance--->The Bible is infallible That's fine for practical reasons (eg politics). But those are essentially different beliefs. They're not on a scale in the same way that Christianity, Buddhism or Zoroastrianism are not on a scale.
    - DanielBMarkham 18y ago
      As a non-religious person, let me offer: I give Jesus the credence I would somebody I met at a bar --->I admire his teachings and do the best I can to emulate him-->I treat all the information I can gather about him to be divinely inspired What something is, that's dogma and inflexible. How I treat it is human nature, and infinitely scalable. As a personal note, I think I'm somewhere between 1 and 2.

netcan 18y ago

I suppose I did if the Gist of "Too many people confuse faith with the idea of absolute belief" is "Too many people assume that faith = literal belief in Genesis, Leviticus or Luke" Certainly absolute beliefs matter in a practical sense. If I were in The States, Obama's beliefs wouldn't worry me. Palin's might. In the very theoretical sense, they both worry me a little. But even Palin's beliefs are probably less likely to affect anything to the degree that her social conservatism (related but not equivalent) is likely to have.

MHollender 18y ago
"But even Palin's beliefs are probably less likely to affect anything to the degree that her social conservatism" Well, I'm not an American and not religious (well, Buddhist but that doesn't really count as a religion), but I fail to see what's wrong with a moderate amount of social conservativism. One of my favourite hobbies is history. And what I learned from history is that liberal periods, when everybody was running around having fun and not caring about much else, were, well, the last period before a collapse. Societies, civilizations when they still had a future before them were very conservative, regarded duty more important than fun, there was a strong focus on families, and so on . It's not something to like or dislike. It's more like a factual thing. A man might be most alive when he is having the most fun, but a society isn't. Think of the Romans, when they still had a lot of will to live, the early period when they really expanded, what virtues they had, gravitas, pietas, dignitas... wasn't very fun and not liberal at all. But they had a very strong will to live. And had a future.

bmj 18y ago

A common apologetic for Christianity is that you either believe Christ was God, or that he was a lunatic. The middle ground (that is, Christ wasn't God but merely a brilliant moral philosopher) is hard to defend given what the Bible says Christ did and said.

tptacek 18y ago
It's not a "middle ground" to suggest that the core beliefs of a religion are false. I'm not saying you have to accept Christianity or Buddhism or Zoroastrianism, but you might be a bit more self-aware.
- netcan 18y ago
  "Middle ground" is just not a great way of looking at things. It's nice to be able to put things on a scale of Jesus was a nice guy--->The bible contains divine guidance--->The Bible is infallible That's fine for practical reasons (eg politics). But those are essentially different beliefs. They're not on a scale in the same way that Christianity, Buddhism or Zoroastrianism are not on a scale.
  - DanielBMarkham 18y ago
    As a non-religious person, let me offer: I give Jesus the credence I would somebody I met at a bar --->I admire his teachings and do the best I can to emulate him-->I treat all the information I can gather about him to be divinely inspired What something is, that's dogma and inflexible. How I treat it is human nature, and infinitely scalable. As a personal note, I think I'm somewhere between 1 and 2.